The Mick & Pat Show - Mountain Spirit with Paul Navarre Part 1

Transcript

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What caught my attention was not only his rounded top tan hat, and it had this beautiful beaded hat band and I went wow, there's got to be a story behind that.

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This medicine bag that was in my pocket was starting to glow and I felt a warmth on my leg, and so I snuck up on him and got within five yards and I could see his antler tips welcome to the Mickey Pat show.

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I'm Mick and I'm Pat and we have a special guest here today that has taken time to join us and record.

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We kind of been talking about this, since we've been talking about hunting so much recently, but we're joined by the.

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If I remember correctly, paul, you were on the board for the Colorado Bowhunters Association.

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I did that for seven years, Mick.

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I was on the board of directors and I was also the DOW liaison for six of those years.

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So I would attend all the Wildlife Commission meetings and then write an article in the CBA magazine to inform our members what was going on at the commission meetings and how that might affect archery and hunting in Colorado.

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Awesome.

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And so yeah, paul Navarro, and what do you do now, paul?

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I mean, you know I'll let you kind of say, you know, like I believe you're retired right.

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I've been retired.

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I'm 84 years old.

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I'll be 85 in March.

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I retired 22 years ago, but not from life, heck, yeah, yeah.

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So after high school, went in the Air Force, six years of college, got a master's degree in regional planning a lot of outdoor activities, biology, geography, geology was hired by the state of South Dakota as a regional planner.

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Loved South Dakota with its pheasants and its deer and its waterfowl.

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Came back to Ohio years later and became a sales rep for a furniture company.

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Did that for 20 years.

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Got my kids out of college, daughter married and then Tricia, my current wife of 42 years.

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We moved out here to Colorado and bought a tourist lodge on Lake Granby and we did a bed and breakfast, restaurant, tavern for 10 years.

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Sold it two months before 9-11, stayed on the lake for a year and then moved to Fort Collins 22 years ago.

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I've always been very active with Colorado Parks and Wildlife and DOW back then and was attended a lot of commission meetings and know a lot of the staff.

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And actually actually a year ago I was the volunteer to be the Colorado Parks and Wildlife Sportsperson's caucus rep on the roundtable which we'd meet with the staff and discuss various things in the Northeast area.

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So I've been involved that way and I keep abreast of what's going on all the time on the conservation side and even on the statewide side also.

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It's like it's kind of like you know you've almost like when I hear your story, kind of background I know that was a very synopsis version, but it's almost like you've lived a whole nother uh career, lifetime, after hanging up the bed and breakfast, you know, I just think it's pretty cool.

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Um and I, and you know, we met uh at a coffee shop.

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I was walking in with my wife Uh, we have, we have nicknames for our wives on the show.

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We call it my, I call her Billie Jean, um and uh.

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We were walking in and I just heard you telling this story and I saw the uh barista just kind of wrapped up in it.

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And then, uh, you complimented my hat and I I was very you hat and I was very, you know, I was very touched and I could see that you had photos out of the hunt that you had just been on recently, and so after hearing your story I just thought, man, dude, this is a guy who I think Pat would love to to hear from as well and I think our viewers would love to hear from.

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So, yeah, we're just really excited to have you on, paul, and we'll be going through some questions today, but again it's you know nothing with too organized and we're just really excited to have you on, paul, and we'll be going through some questions today, but again it's you know nothing too organized and we're pretty much just going to go with the flow.

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But, pat, do you get the first question that you kind of want to touch base on?

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For sure?

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for sure.

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Yeah, I think that I want to start with kind of some of the stuff you shared with us before we hit record, which would be you know what?

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What was your?

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What's your hunting background, upbringing?

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Like you know, you mentioned some of those different states already, but, yeah, tell our listeners about how you got into hunting and where you were born and how that, how that kind of, has affected a lifelong pursuit.

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Well, sure so in 1940, and you got to remember that's when I was born, in March of 1940.

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You got to remember that was before the Second World War started in Europe.

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Yeah, that's crazy.

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That was before there was any smartphones.

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That was before there was any television.

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We had radio.

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We had newspapers.

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We had two cent stamps to mail people because we had write a letter, actually write a letter, and send it through the postal service.

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So a lot of things were happening back then.

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My parents were born in 1913, 1940.

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Dad was born in Toledo, ohio.

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My mom was a farm gal 11 children in Pittsburgh, kansas, and what I remember a picture of her beautiful gal standing there in the yard with a shotgun and a brace of rabbits in her hand when she was 19 years old.

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And and they you know, they were raising a cow.

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They probably had some pigs and some chickens and they'd go out and shoot a couple rabbits.

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And so they grew up in a rural area in Ohio and also Pittsburgh, kansas.

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And so I grew up in a rural area in Ohio with no television, with no smartphones, with no organized sports except at high school.

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Kids went out and did what they had to do in the out of doors and I've always been an outdoor guy.

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Lived on Lake Erie.

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When I was nine years old, could hear the water crashing on the rocks 200 yards from the house, get me up in the morning and everybody I knew kids all had a bike.

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You better take the fenders off because if you left them on, you were a sissy.

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We had a dog.

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I had a black, a golden retriever back then named Lassie, because this was during the Lassie time.

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We all had a .22 or a shotgun and we'd go with chuck hunting.

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We'd go squirrel hunting, we'd go squirrel hunting, we'd go rabbit hunting.

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We'd go shoot a duck.

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Once in a while We'd bring it home, we'd clean it and Mom would cook them.

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And Dad was a hunter.

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He was more of a social hunter.

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He'd go with the guys.

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He'd go out to the duck marsh.

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He'd go deer hunting with the guys.

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They'd stay in hotels or motels around, you know, in new york and pennsylvania, but I've always enjoyed the outer doors and, of course, because kids would fish nearby.

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Can I ask a question on that?

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I'm just curious, as children I imagine.

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Was there not like a like official tags that you guys needed or anything for, like small game collection and harvesting or anything like that?

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As?

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kids.

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Well, there was when you became aged.

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You had to have a special license.

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Oh okay, all right.

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And sometimes you know kids cheat.

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You know, yeah, you know you, you might shoot a robin with a 22 or a slingshot or which you know we know better than do that, so probably that was out of ignorance, but once my dad gave me a 12 gauge shotgun to gee, he gave me a hand-me-down shotgun winchester model 97 pump.

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That was too long to everything and he gave that to me and I remember the first rabbit I ever shot with it and I can still remember that.

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So I grew up in the hunting atmosphere in the rural areas.

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We worked on the farms, farms for extra money, at a buck an hour, 75 cents an hour, detasseling corn, picking raspberries, strawberries, potatoes, coming home at the end of the month week with maybe 30 bucks which our parents would take half of it and put it in a piggy bank.

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But we could go buy a new baseball glove.

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And I was a sports guy, played football, terrible at basketball, ran track and yeah so that's awesome.

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And then after high school you mentioned you told us you joined the force, the Air Force.

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I did yes, yes, yeah, and it was during that time.

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You also, if I remember right.

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That was when you took your first with a recurve.

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Yes, exactly.

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What was your air force experience like?

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It's also my uh, my uh, from my air force family.

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My grandpa, great grandpa, were, you know, in both in and that's how, that's how I actually came to be was because they were on the same flight crew and then one guy married the other guy's daughter and so so wonderful.

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So now here I am, but, um, so the uh, what was that?

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That experience, and during that time is kind of like the Air Force was so in its infancy too, is kind of a new, exciting thing.

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And also and then you were, you also got to do this Tell us about your recurve hunt and what the Air Force is like for you as well.

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Sure.

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Well, I graduated from high school in 1958 and I was not college material at the time high school in 1958 and I was not college material at the time.

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I got A's in shop and maybe C's and this and that Excellent.

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And I wasn't good in math and chemistry I never took.

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But one of my idols in the area was a game warden and I thought, god, that'd be so cool to be in the outer doors and be a game warden.

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But I wasn't college material.

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I just didn't have the background for that and maybe I didn't know how to study properly it's hard to tell in high school.

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And so I went in the Air Force and this was in 1959 now, when there were some recessions going on and people weren't doing very well and my dad was a sales rep for a furniture company and doing fair but not great, and my sister was at Ohio State.

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She was 20 months older than I am, so I knew my parents couldn't afford to college education.

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So I went in the Air Force, just to grow up maybe.

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And I went in the Air Force and I was stationed in the Upper Peninsula of Michigan, right off Lake Superior, at KISO Air Force Base, which is now defunct, you know probably the county bought it for a dollar but it was a SAC base and I was a radar operator.

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So I went to Biloxi, mississippi.

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First of all.

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I went to Lackland Air Force Base for basic training and scored very well with the rifle the M1 or M2 we use at the rifle range and then went to Biloxi, mississippi, to do radar school, electronic school, and then was stationed in the Upper Peninsula.

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Our SAC base was a radar operator and we were inland from Lake Superior and we were right in this big high plateau in the Upper Peninsula where the base was and gee, there were deer there, okay, lots of deer in the woods around it.

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So I've always been an archery hunter, even as a kid growing up I always kind of took the side of the Indian culture.

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You know, riding around on my bike with my mom's lipstick on me as war paint and a little hatchet in my hand at eight years old and building tree huts and you know doing things like that.

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So I bought a bow at the base BX, a 50 pound maybe it's 45, 45, 50 pound Ben Pearson bow Bought some wood arrows with some feathers on it and a three blade bodkin head and went out in the woods and that second year I was out there I shot a doe deer woods.

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And that second year I was out there I shot a doe deer and when I got back I carried it out off base over the fence four strand fence back to the base and from then on I was called Robin Hood.

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That was my new moniker.

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Here comes Robin Hood carrying the and luckily Sergeant Kearns was a guy, an NCO, from Oklahoma, and he was a hunter.

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So I called him up and we butchered the deer and we put it in his freezer and he would invite myself and my roommate over for dinner.

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So that was kind of nice and I was a member of the sportsman's club and so I got the only deer with the bow and I also got the biggest deer with the bow.

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So I got a $20 prize for doing that and that was my first deer ever in 1962.

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That's 62 years ago.

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Yeah, okay, well, and there was no one, or maybe there was, but did you just decide one day you're like, all right, well, I'll give it a shot, do this bow hunting.

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Or did you have anyone kind of help teach you like the basic principles and stuff for deer hunting with a bow, or was it all just kind of stuff you applied from growing up as a kid and learning?

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Well, it stems from this as kids and this was before compound bows, sure, and this is around the time when Fred Bear started making news about his exploits around the country and the bear bow manufacturing.

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He was a advertiser for Ford Motor Company and he had a boy who was actually making bows for him in the Detroit area.

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But he decided to go to Michigan and start a bow manufacturing company where they would be making them en masse, and so that's how he started his bow business, fred Bear, and so he was an icon, and so there were stories about Fred Bear.

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So he was an icon, and so there were stories about Fred Bear.

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Also, when I was growing up, things to do in the marshes we would club carp as they came in the Lake Erie marshes to spawn.

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We'd go out there with our dogs and we'd have a pitchfork, we'd make a little gig spears, we would take a hoe and maybe sharpen the edge.

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And you know, kids, what we did we'd come out of the marshes with blood suckers on us and fall.

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You know that's what we did.

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Once in a while I would look into my mom's drawer for a knife and go oh, she wouldn't miss this.

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I think I'll take this long butcher knife and put barbs on it and tie it to a broom handle and that will be my spear.

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Well, she caught on to that real quick, matter of fact, maybe after the second knife disappeared.

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So they took me down and bought me a fiberglass Shakespeare bow and an arrow and a string that attached to this reel that you hooked to your bow.

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And that's how he became a bow shooter for carp Nice and that's how he started and I'd shoot carp and I even shot illegally a northern pike once.

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But then, when I went into service, I knew about bow hunting and it just seemed logical to go bow hunting.

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That's awesome and it was a nice time to do it in the fall.

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So that's how I got involved in it.

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Were you just wearing, like your Air Force M81 camo?

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That's interesting because so think about Fred Bear.

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So I had my black brogans on, I had my green flight pants.

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I went, maybe to who knows, Sears and Roebuck or JCPenney or somewhere in Marquette, michigan, and bought a Woodlands camo pullover shirt with a little hood on it and I had this floppy hat To camo my face and my hands.

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I took burnt cork.

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Oh nice, that's what Fred Bear did.

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He put burnt cord on his face and he put it on his hands to camouflage that shiny skin.

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And that's what I did and that's what I had.

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None of this modern camo like we have today, but I have some of that.

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That's awesome.

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I think that's just really cool, especially to someone like me who's never gone deer hunting, to just hear, like you know, in the modern day and age everyone's trying to sell a product Right and so, like there's so many people trying to sell you like on the best cutting edge thing before you even know like the fundamentals and experience that.

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And so I think it's just cool to hear, like how you know you, just you, you had the disciplines and you kind of had the conception of you know what it would look like and you just went for it.

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Um, it's just cool to hear that that you know.

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That's kind of really similar to like how I remember my childhood and like, um, you know, we did like rabbit hunting and, uh, bird hunting and you know we would kill the rabbits in the garden for my grandma and we'd use our pellet rifle and you know bows and it was, it was really fun and it's just kind of cool to hear that, like you know, you had the same kind of disciplines growing up and that that was an easy avenue getting into the sport I think the the, uh, the time period I grew up and there was a lot of people that's still living in the rural area.

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Yeah, and they understood the balance of habitat yeah if they had a cattle ranch, they understood they could only have so many cows on that land.

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If they had chickens, they could only have so many in the yard, because that was the balance of how many critters they could have on that piece of land.

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And then people grew up, like my mom, butchering things, so they knew life and death and they were experiencing that.

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They didn't go to a grocery store and go back in the meat counter and find this sanitized piece of meat that had no blood or no gore on it.

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It was all saran wrapped and when you ask people where did it come from, they don't know.

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Okay, and but I know where and my mom knew and my dad knew when they went hunting where that animal came from and so I know where.

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When I eating my, the wild game that I eat, I know exactly where it came from.

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It doesn't have any growth hormones, it doesn't have any antibacterial shots in it and things like that.

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It's all wild game, the natural things, and the meat is wonderful.

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And so I grew up in that atmosphere and I grew up in the rural area and I think people that are living in the cities today just don't understand that cycle of wildlife and how they go through their lives and how they can be harvested legally to maintain a balance.

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So I grew up in that atmosphere.

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You know it was a time a time, I think when hunting wasn't a politically polarizing thing either, like where it'd be assumed which side you stood on.

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It's still not true, you know, there's still, you can still hunt, and be what you want to be.

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Be whatever you want to be but there did take the through that, like probably the eight, like the 70s, 80s.

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They're kind of this bent into like um, you know, uh, uh, elmer fudd, you know, out there just killing it.

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You know what I'm saying.

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This is like it.

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It's over time to become more uh it's become more one-sided right and versus like a thing where people maybe would understand.

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Well, I remember getting on my bike after a football game friday night and I'd get on my bike with my 22 and and right out of of where I lived and across the highway and down some state highway with a .22 over my shoulder and nobody was saying, oh, here's a kid heading for the high school to eliminate his buddies or do this.

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They knew that.

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Oh, here's a guy that's going to go hunting.

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Or if you went over on Farmer Jones' property he would see you out there and he'd go hey, paul, having a good time, having a good time.

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But today there's so much social media out there and, of course, the challenge of oh, the challenge of.

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Sifting through it.

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Well, yes, the lies or the BS.

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Well, not only that, but there's been some really negative experiences going on in communities with firearms.

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Yeah, okay, and I'm a legal firearm owner.

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I respect firearms, I know how to handle them properly, and there's a lot of bad people out there that hit firearms and, unfortunately, do bad things, and I always call them the 10 percenters, whether they're on the highway screaming past you at 90 miles an hour in a 50 mile an hour zone, or whether they're stealing from your house or breaking in your car or cheating on their taxes or poachers.

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There's always those 10 percenters that the rules don't abide by that and those are the ones you hear about.

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There's a lot of great good people out there doing wonderful things, kids included, and I meet them every day.

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Because I'd like to ask people simple questions.

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If I'm in a coffee shop, whether I'm at Owl Cafe, or if I'm at Meal my Pies where I'm at Starbucks, a simple question.

00:20:00.703 --> 00:20:02.191
They're reading the paper.

00:20:02.191 --> 00:20:03.737
I said is there any good news today?

00:20:03.737 --> 00:20:07.567
And an hour later you can have this wonderful conversation and find out who were there.

00:20:08.289 --> 00:20:11.740
I met a guy this is going to be off subject a little bit Just before I got here.

00:20:11.740 --> 00:20:22.224
I'm sitting there reading a book on Crazy Horse, okay, and I looked up, the guy next to me had this big scar down the back of his head.

00:20:22.224 --> 00:20:34.804
Before I left, I said excuse me, but tell me about the scar on the back of your neck.

00:20:34.804 --> 00:20:41.000
He says I broke my neck and I almost died and I broke all three one, two and three and I saw and I I should he should be dead.

00:20:41.000 --> 00:20:42.162
I said how did this happen?

00:20:42.162 --> 00:20:50.142
He says I was on a fat tire mountain bike and it got slippery and I crashed and landed on my head and when I landed.

00:20:50.182 --> 00:21:03.035
I knew I broke my neck Holy smokes and he had all this stuff done and the odds of him surviving that medically I mean almost 90% good was almost zero.

00:21:03.035 --> 00:21:09.403
And here he is alive and he went through that and so I would have never known about this person.

00:21:09.403 --> 00:21:12.832
Because of what?

00:21:12.832 --> 00:21:17.763
I just ask him a simple question, because I don't have a smartphone and I don't text people.

00:21:17.763 --> 00:21:28.164
I talk to people and so I met him and I met Kovson Friar Martinez, the Indian that gave me the medicine bag, and I just met you.

00:21:28.164 --> 00:21:30.840
Yeah, simple questions, it's just.

00:21:30.840 --> 00:21:32.645
I enjoy talking to people.

00:21:32.987 --> 00:21:36.226
Yeah, yeah, well, and I don't know, is that a good transition, you think, pat?

00:21:36.226 --> 00:21:36.847
To the next one.

00:21:37.381 --> 00:21:39.248
I think I've got a few more things before we roll into that.

00:21:40.161 --> 00:21:47.654
Sure, I feel like in myself I struggle with people just being objects to move around in my day.

00:21:47.654 --> 00:21:52.010
You know, if it's at a barista, it's just a person to pour me a cup of coffee.

00:21:52.010 --> 00:21:56.250
The car in front of me is just someone who's driving too slow and I got to get around them.

00:21:56.250 --> 00:22:02.712
That's not who I am, but in the modern culture we live in, it is just very easy.

00:22:02.712 --> 00:22:04.727
We don't even live in that big of a town.

00:22:04.727 --> 00:22:07.068
It's not a small town but it's not a giant big city.

00:22:07.068 --> 00:22:30.145
It's like the uh, more and more you see that where I think people just have lost and are losing that, um, that connectivity via just simple questions, asking stuff and um and how a simple question to somebody can, you know, move you into a conversation or can make their day or make them feel known or help you learn something you would have never known.

00:22:30.365 --> 00:22:34.743
Well, and I try to make a point of Tricia says Paul, you'd talk to a tree?

00:22:34.743 --> 00:22:36.807
Oh yeah, why not?

00:22:36.807 --> 00:22:39.373
And so maybe I'll learn something.

00:22:39.373 --> 00:22:43.832
And I've had a couple of people say, Paul, thank you so much for coming up and engaging me.

00:22:43.832 --> 00:22:48.090
And there was a homeless gal at Starbucks this morning.

00:22:48.090 --> 00:22:57.905
All of her bags of stuff were there and I said good morning to her and she looked at me and put a smile on her face and she was going through.

00:22:57.905 --> 00:23:04.522
I can't imagine what she's going through in her life, but maybe just me recognize her as a human being and saying hello, just acknowledging.

00:23:04.522 --> 00:23:32.284
And as I'm walking down the street at Fort Collins or anywhere and someone's coming towards me, I normally say hello and sometimes they look up shocked that someone has actually spoken to them and if they got their face and fingers down in their iPads and doing texting somebody, they're not recognizing what's going on around them.

00:23:32.284 --> 00:23:33.067
I'm trying to be aware of all the time.

00:23:33.067 --> 00:23:34.634
Being a hunter, I think I've got the ability to see what's going on around me.

00:23:34.653 --> 00:23:56.493
I'm always aware of what's going on around me, so, and I'm hearing things that maybe other people don't see or hear, and maybe I'm seeing things that other people don't see just because I'm aware, and I'm using my eyes and my ears and not only my mind and my body to move forward, but I'm looking around me all the time, for good and bad things so yeah, no, I think that's a good point and you, uh, you've been on a journey.

00:23:56.554 --> 00:24:11.882
Now for you, you, you moved to Colorado in in the early 90s, yes, and I guess really that would be, if I'm not mistaken, that's when you're kind of started this journey towards the 10 whether you knew it or not then of these, these 10 big game species well.

00:24:11.961 --> 00:24:25.673
And that's all interesting because after I gave up my sales job and got my kids out of college and daughter married, I had come out to colorado in 88 and 89 as a non-resident from Ohio to elk hunt.

00:24:25.673 --> 00:24:37.332
And I think anybody from the Midwest who hunts deer has a dream about going out West whether they're from Wisconsin or New York or somewhere to go out West and go elk hunting.

00:24:37.332 --> 00:24:41.854
And here in Colorado we've got close to 300,000 elk in our state.

00:24:41.854 --> 00:24:43.560
That's almost one in every five elk.

00:24:43.560 --> 00:24:45.250
In every state that has elk we have one in five or one in four elk in our state.

00:24:45.250 --> 00:24:46.056
That's almost one in every five elk.

00:24:46.056 --> 00:24:49.166
In every state that has elk we have one in five or one in four elk in this state.

00:24:49.186 --> 00:24:49.627
I didn't know that.

00:24:49.627 --> 00:24:50.570
I didn't know we had that many.

00:24:50.651 --> 00:24:53.741
Yeah, it's probably.

00:24:53.741 --> 00:24:59.473
It's gone anywhere from a high of 320 to around 280,000.

00:24:59.473 --> 00:25:01.627
So around in that period of time.

00:25:01.627 --> 00:25:06.906
And so that was my dream to come out here and I had the money to do it.

00:25:06.906 --> 00:25:09.750
Back then the non-resident license was $250.

00:25:09.750 --> 00:25:12.730
Now it's almost $700, but inflation and da da da.

00:25:14.040 --> 00:25:17.270
So I came out here and I hunted up on the flat tops and I'm a solo hunter.

00:25:17.270 --> 00:25:25.920
So what I did is I contacted, with my background of natural resources.

00:25:25.920 --> 00:25:36.645
I contacted the division of wildlife, then DOW that's what they were and talked to Larry Green over there and I said, larry, I'm from Ohio and I'm trying to get some information about the flat top wilderness area.

00:25:36.645 --> 00:25:38.076
What can you tell me about it?

00:25:38.076 --> 00:25:44.406
He says well, I'm a bow hunter and I've hunted up in there, but remember, you can't take any vehicles up there.

00:25:44.446 --> 00:25:45.368
You can't even take a up there.

00:25:45.368 --> 00:25:46.332
You can't even take a bicycle.

00:25:46.332 --> 00:25:48.041
You can't even take a one-wheel cart.

00:25:48.041 --> 00:25:50.970
Anything that's mechanical you can't take in the wilderness area.

00:25:50.970 --> 00:25:58.884
He says I would recommend that you hunt this area instead of going up there, because then if you get an elk down you could get a packer to come up and help you.

00:25:58.884 --> 00:26:06.508
So that first year I did that and I actually missed an elk at close range, hit a little limb and ricocheted.

00:26:06.508 --> 00:26:13.772
But that got me so excited to come out the next year and I finally killed my first bull elk in 1989.

00:26:14.134 --> 00:26:14.255
Okay.

00:26:14.440 --> 00:26:15.765
And that got me really excited.

00:26:15.765 --> 00:26:18.138
And that, probably what region of Colorado was that in?

00:26:18.138 --> 00:26:32.051
That was down north of Dot Zero, north of Glenwood Springs, okay, and up in the Flat Top Wilderness Area on the south side of the flat tops Awesome, and that's one of the largest elk herds in Colorado, the northwest region.

00:26:32.051 --> 00:26:36.425
There's more elk than anywhere else and that used to be over the counter area.

00:26:36.425 --> 00:26:42.084
Now it's a limited draw, okay, and I haven't hunted there, but I hunt other places.

00:26:42.084 --> 00:26:42.964
Sure, I do.

00:26:42.964 --> 00:26:46.428
Very well, I've killed 15 elk with my bow, wow, yeah.

00:26:46.448 --> 00:26:47.429
That's a pretty good take.

00:26:47.809 --> 00:26:52.034
Well, last year I got a nice cow elk just 80 miles west of here in the same area.

00:26:52.034 --> 00:26:54.057
I killed my moose this year, and that's another story.

00:26:54.057 --> 00:27:08.580
And then the year before that I didn't get one, but the year before that I got a nice bull elk on the flat tops with my recurve and because that was, I wrote a story for the Colorado Bowhunters magazine about bucket list bull.

00:27:08.580 --> 00:27:18.202
Because you have things on your bucket list what you would like to do in life, sure, and one of my bucket list subjects was to kill a bull elk with my recurve bow.

00:27:18.202 --> 00:27:22.340
And so I did that and I wrote a story for the Colorado Bowhunters magazine.

00:27:22.340 --> 00:27:32.305
And so that's how I kind of came to Colorado and that's how I started hunting, got excited about that.

00:27:32.305 --> 00:27:34.695
And then this Big Ten.

00:27:34.695 --> 00:27:37.542
We have 10 big game species here in Colorado.

00:27:39.171 --> 00:27:40.273
This is, of course, a non-test.

00:27:40.273 --> 00:27:42.740
This is just for our folks who are hunting illiterate.

00:27:42.740 --> 00:27:43.602
Will you just go through them?

00:27:43.602 --> 00:27:44.009
Sure.

00:27:44.049 --> 00:27:44.330
I will.

00:27:44.330 --> 00:27:47.459
So let's start with both species of deer.

00:27:47.459 --> 00:27:53.155
We have white-tailed and mule deer, then we have the elk, then we have the elk, then we have the pronghorn.

00:27:53.155 --> 00:27:57.391
It's not an antelope, it's a pronghorn Antelope.

00:27:57.391 --> 00:27:59.498
There's no antelope in North America.

00:27:59.498 --> 00:28:27.400
Yeah, okay, see, there's a pronghorn, and then so that's four, and then we have the mountain lion, we have the bear, so there's six, and then we have the bighorn sheep and the mountain goat, so there's eight species, and Colorado Bowhunters, which have been around for 75 years and is the voice for bowhunting in Colorado, and I would encourage everybody that's a bowhunter to join the Colorado Bowhunters coloradobowhuntingorg.

00:28:27.400 --> 00:28:30.916
We're a wonderful organization.

00:28:31.650 --> 00:28:33.035
Anyway, the last two.

00:28:33.035 --> 00:28:39.422
So you get those eight first, and then the last two is the moose and the desert bighorn sheep.

00:28:39.422 --> 00:28:42.617
Now, what's different about the desert bighorn sheep?

00:28:42.617 --> 00:28:46.981
It's a lottery and not a preference point draw.

00:28:46.981 --> 00:28:52.036
So some of the animals are over-the-counter, which means you can just get a tag.

00:28:52.036 --> 00:29:06.617
In other ones it's all about supply and demand, like sheep and goats and even moose, where you have to apply for a few years before you can get a license because you're gathering preference points over the guy behind you with less preference.

00:29:06.617 --> 00:29:19.195
But the Desert Bighorn is a lottery where you could draw the first year or never, and there's only 15 tags and there's 25,000 people applying for them, so the odds are really, really slim.

00:29:19.195 --> 00:29:21.582
There's only three guys that have taken all 10 species.

00:29:22.710 --> 00:29:44.211
So when I first heard about the Big Eight, I was at a CBA banquet first year I ever came to Colorado or second year, joined them right away and was at a banquet and I was hearing some guys talk about the big eight and I thought they were talking about football and as I listened more, they were talking about wildlife.

00:29:44.211 --> 00:29:52.814
And then I learned about the big eight species and that some of them had killed one or two of those species and maybe some three or four.

00:29:52.814 --> 00:30:02.519
And so when I completed the eight and it was the ultimate goal was what's neat about all these animals?

00:30:02.519 --> 00:30:14.356
They all live in different habitats, from the pronghorn way down on the prairie to the bighorn sheep and the mountain goat that are living up at 12,000, 13,000 feet, and they all need the same thing.

00:30:14.356 --> 00:30:19.536
They need escape routes, but they need food, shelter and water, and so they're all different.

00:30:19.650 --> 00:30:25.516
So as a hunter, to be good about this, you need to learn about those animals and what are they doing when you're hunting them.

00:30:25.516 --> 00:30:30.036
Is it pre-rut, is it during the rut, is it post-rut, is it during the rut, is it post-rut?

00:30:30.036 --> 00:30:32.353
What are they doing during the time when you're actually hunting them?

00:30:32.353 --> 00:30:35.461
And how can you change your ways of hunting them?

00:30:35.461 --> 00:30:37.994
Are they callable, are they decoyable?

00:30:37.994 --> 00:30:38.936
Are they stockable?

00:30:38.936 --> 00:30:40.441
Where are they banded up?

00:30:40.441 --> 00:30:41.211
Are they singles?

00:30:41.211 --> 00:30:44.900
So you learn all about this, and each animal is slightly different.

00:30:45.500 --> 00:30:46.569
So that's the challenge.

00:30:46.569 --> 00:30:51.573
And then the meat is all this meat is wonderful, whether it's big horn, sheep or mountain goat, some better than the others.

00:30:51.573 --> 00:31:08.000
And but that was the challenge of going, and, luckily and good enough, in 11 years I took the big eight species, my moose tag this year, and we can tell that story a little bit later.

00:31:08.000 --> 00:31:11.142
Sure, and that's been a wonderful hunt, and we'll explain that a little bit later.

00:31:11.142 --> 00:31:22.467
And then the last one, and, being at 85 in March, I might just have to age out of this and not get it, but a miracle happened on my moose hunt when I got that tag.

00:31:22.467 --> 00:31:27.932
So maybe another miracle in the next couple of years will happen, hopefully that that desert bighorn will show up.

00:31:27.932 --> 00:31:30.038
So that's how I learned about the big eight, and they're all.

00:31:30.097 --> 00:31:38.518
Let me stress this, though it's just not happenstance that we have a wonderful amount of big game species in Colorado.

00:31:38.518 --> 00:32:01.569
All these animals are scientifically managed by state wildlife biologists who are in the field every day and are looking out for the welfare of these animals in the correct population and the habitat that supports them, and they use hunters as that tool to maintain that viable population.

00:32:01.569 --> 00:32:08.304
So everybody in Colorado can enjoy wildlife, whether they're wildlife watchers, bighorn sheep, mountain goats, elk.

00:32:08.304 --> 00:32:13.894
People go into Rocket Mountain National Park and love to hear the elk, but they're there for a reason.

00:32:13.894 --> 00:32:36.046
In the numbers that are there and around the state and we see deer along the highways we see other animals in good abundance because they're being managed properly for their environment and, yes, hunters are using them as food source, but they're illegally taking those and they're all restricted to certain numbers that they can take out of certain areas.

00:32:36.430 --> 00:33:02.238
So it's all being scientifically managed properly 1950 or sooner, the the you might, your chances of getting into these animals would have been quite a bit slimmer, especially in the even more walking back into, you know, early 1900s, the populations were, um, nothing like what they are today.

00:33:02.238 --> 00:33:05.593
You know because, because we hadn't managed them.

00:33:05.633 --> 00:33:07.278
You know because we had no doubt about it.

00:33:07.318 --> 00:33:16.750
The way that, um, we do now, and so that north american model for managing wildlife is, I think it's, uh, something a lot of people don't really understand or know about.

00:33:16.750 --> 00:33:32.093
They think that they'll, especially, you know, if you come from just like the, a big city in the, and you don't realize that, um, there's been a lot of work going into, you know, conserving what we have out here and really, you know it's not like there is no there.

00:33:32.093 --> 00:33:51.981
We have kept wild places wild, but there is no place in america where we, especially lower 48, where we haven't put our hands in it or around it to keep it what it is or to improve what it is, you know, and so you don't just come out to the wild to see an elk from the like as if, as if you were a pioneer or something right now it now.

00:33:52.021 --> 00:33:56.711
It's something that's special that we've kept, you know, and kept in up well, and, and there's no doubt about it.

00:33:56.730 --> 00:34:00.403
So, for an example, let's take the population of cal of colorado.

00:34:00.423 --> 00:34:12.900
I was born in 1940 and there was 1.1 million people in colorado okay now think about what was going on in in 1940 in colorado, where people were living and what were they doing here?

00:34:12.900 --> 00:34:19.461
They were logging, they were mining, and then, of course, people had stores and the ski areas hadn't even been developed back then.

00:34:19.461 --> 00:34:27.443
And then when Trisha and I moved here in 1992, 91, there was 3.2 million, all right.

00:34:27.443 --> 00:34:31.101
And now here we are in 2024, there is five point going on 5.8 million, all right.

00:34:31.101 --> 00:34:40.659
And now here we are in 2024, there is five point going on 5.8 million people in Colorado, and they're predicting, you know, another million in the next 20 years and maybe even more.

00:34:41.021 --> 00:34:41.202
Yeah.

00:34:41.429 --> 00:34:46.110
So we're trying to maintain the division of wildlife Colorado parks and wildlife.

00:34:46.110 --> 00:35:05.539
We're trying to maintain viable wildlife populations through using science based on the habitat and also based on well based on science, and so I'm struggling a little bit.

00:35:05.539 --> 00:35:14.849
So the populations are threatened by the overabundance of people, building infrastructure, habitat loss.

00:35:14.849 --> 00:35:28.074
Yes, yeah so, and you can look up on the front right here out of Fort Collins and look up on the foothills and maybe 30 years ago there weren't any houses up there, and now all along the skylines and in there there's houses.

00:35:28.074 --> 00:35:32.344
And then look on the interstates what's going on there?

00:35:32.610 --> 00:35:35.599
Migration corridors and roadways, on and on and on Sure.

00:35:36.150 --> 00:35:45.396
So that's one of the biggest downfalls of wildlife is how they can move from one area to another and then where they used to have good food and water.

00:35:45.396 --> 00:35:52.152
That water is being used up more and more and more and I know right over here around fort collins we have some deer.

00:35:52.152 --> 00:36:00.454
I've seen I goose hunt locally with my bow, within five minutes of my house, and I've seen bobcat there.

00:36:00.454 --> 00:36:11.476
I've seen mountain lion uh, coyotes neighbor saw two mountain lion cubs run across the pasture a couple years ago.

00:36:11.476 --> 00:36:18.918
Maybe some turkeys Not turkeys yet, but white-tailed mule deer, eagles, on and on and on.

00:36:18.918 --> 00:36:33.362
So we have wildlife right here and I bet, I know right now that within 10 miles and maybe even 5 miles of where we're sitting right now there's a mountain lion somewhere Down along the river and I've seen trail camera pictures on people's backyards.

00:36:33.570 --> 00:36:36.739
Yeah, the ring camera doorbells, right yeah, right, showing you where they're walking.

00:36:36.900 --> 00:36:37.360
Yeah, yeah.

00:36:37.360 --> 00:36:57.510
So wildlife is around and it's here every day, but it has to be controlled because the human population is growing and we're using up the wildlife spaces and so we need trained biologists within Parks and Wildlife to manage that wildlife so everybody.

00:36:57.510 --> 00:37:01.300
And then we need hundreds of dollars to buy licenses to hunt legally, to fund the infrastructure of Colorado Parks and Wildlife.

00:37:01.300 --> 00:37:10.755
We're talking about law enforcement, we're talking about gasoline vehicles and regional managers and staff and on and on and on to do this.

00:37:10.755 --> 00:37:17.318
And it takes money, and hardly any of that money it comes from general fund, it comes from hunting and fishing and licenses.

00:37:17.829 --> 00:37:19.128
Yeah, it's like 98%.

00:37:19.371 --> 00:37:20.396
Well, not quite that.

00:37:20.396 --> 00:37:31.900
Maybe 70 to 80%, because we get some from Go Colorado funds, we get some from the Pittman-Roppert Act which puts a tax on archery and firearms and ammunition.

00:37:31.900 --> 00:37:34.715
That's 11 percent.

00:37:34.715 --> 00:37:44.739
It's given back to the state based on the number of hunters and fishermen, and maybe 1 percent comes from the general fund, and so that's, that's the whole package.

00:37:45.710 --> 00:37:52.043
One thing I just did find ironic was how many people I know who are very pro-conservation.

00:37:52.043 --> 00:38:00.519
I would say like I don't want to throw a blanket, like environmentalists yeah, they're environmentalists in that like they're actually anti-people.

00:38:00.519 --> 00:38:06.940
They're anti-people expansion but they're pro-conservation and they're very anti-hunting.

00:38:07.692 --> 00:38:22.375
But so many of them elected out of the colorado parks and wildlife fee for their license registration renewal oh, yeah, and I just always thought that was so ironic, like it's only, like I think I refer, remember right 50 bucks on top of your car registration each year.

00:38:22.375 --> 00:38:41.567
Now, and it's just crazy to me that, like so many of those people are the ones that elect out of it, and it's like like that's one of the best ways If you don't believe in hunting, that's one of the best avenues you can do just passively to help support Colorado Parks and Wildlife Conservation is just let that be renewed on your car registration each year.

00:38:42.190 --> 00:38:49.501
But to still be in if you put your money where your mouth is Exactly, yeah, it's called Keep Colorado Wild.

00:38:49.621 --> 00:38:51.596
Yeah, and it adds what?

00:38:51.596 --> 00:38:52.719
$30 or something.

00:38:52.730 --> 00:38:53.954
Maybe it's $30, $50.

00:38:53.954 --> 00:38:54.838
I can't remember exactly.

00:38:54.949 --> 00:39:00.057
Well, and a big portion of that goes to parks yeah, for renewal, for maintenance, et cetera.

00:39:00.057 --> 00:39:05.416
Maybe a small portion goes to wildlife management, okay Okay, but a big park goes.

00:39:05.416 --> 00:39:12.755
There's so many people now want to go out into Colorado and enjoy, and years back back the parks used to just be full on weekends.

00:39:12.755 --> 00:39:16.690
Now they're in the summer, they're full year around and you hear people.

00:39:16.690 --> 00:39:26.045
So many people are not so many people, but, uh, you hear 10 or 20 people drowning in some of the state park yeah because they just they're not outdoor people.

00:39:26.085 --> 00:39:30.159
they're going out and doing stupid things and kayaks and without life vests those paddle boards.

00:39:30.199 --> 00:39:32.016
man, I'm anti-paddle board, by the way.

00:39:32.137 --> 00:39:35.259
Really, just because so many people are irresponsible, it's like a fad.

00:39:35.670 --> 00:39:42.242
Get on a paddle board and they don't realize you should still have a life Because you're out in a lake and that thing, wind kicks up, turns into a sail and you have no life jacket.

00:39:42.242 --> 00:39:46.034
That thing's gone.

00:39:46.034 --> 00:39:50.119
Colorado, get the paddleboard off Amazon and get out in the middle of Lake and that's what's.

00:39:50.119 --> 00:39:56.226
You know just not having everything else in our lives is made so safe.

00:39:56.226 --> 00:40:07.213
You know, like every, every little thing we do, you know every in a building, every step is marked with a yellow strip and the stoplight tells you to stop going so you don't get ran over by a car.

00:40:07.213 --> 00:40:10.862
You don't have to have any really personal awareness looking out around you.

00:40:10.862 --> 00:40:16.121
Like you were saying earlier, being a hunter, you get a sense of awareness around you.

00:40:16.121 --> 00:40:19.701
You don't have to carry this awareness around you because we've insulated it.

00:40:19.701 --> 00:40:23.882
But then you go to a wild place and all of a sudden that's all gone.

00:40:24.610 --> 00:40:25.472
Well, what's interesting?

00:40:25.472 --> 00:40:26.992
I've been a boater all my life.

00:40:26.992 --> 00:40:37.385
My dad had a boat and I boated on Lake Erie for walleyes, and then I had a 25-foot well-crafted sportsman on the Great Lakes for salmon and steelhead, and I had a canoe and now I have a kayak.

00:40:39.909 --> 00:40:42.492
I know some people who are very jealous of what you just said yeah, I mean I did all that type of fishing.

00:40:42.634 --> 00:40:44.876
I've steelhead fished in Michigan with the fly rod.

00:40:44.936 --> 00:40:47.079
I've gone out to Oregon and Washington steelhead.

00:40:47.079 --> 00:40:51.525
You know I just love the outdoor fishing aspect of it and the challenge of doing it right.

00:40:51.525 --> 00:40:55.489
But we're blessed here in Colorado, for sure.

00:40:55.489 --> 00:41:08.298
We have got thousands upon millions of national forests which you can walk in and there's no fences, yeah, and you can just wander around.

00:41:08.298 --> 00:41:10.382
And for a hunter, that's great, for recreation, it's great around.

00:41:10.382 --> 00:41:11.751
And for a hunter, that's great for recreation, it's great.

00:41:11.751 --> 00:41:13.253
For campers, it's great.

00:41:14.356 --> 00:41:15.798
Uh, we have blm lands.

00:41:15.798 --> 00:41:23.554
We have state lands, a huge portion of of lands here in in colorado that do that, yeah.

00:41:23.554 --> 00:41:44.490
Um, we have state, uh, waterfall orowl areas where I hunt on the South Platte River and I was out there just last week trying to get my dog his first mallard of the year and we finally had a mallard, a dracon hen, come in and I shot one of them and they made a nice retrieve, nice, you know.

00:41:44.490 --> 00:41:48.916
And we ate the duck, it was delicious the next day and the dog got a good experience.

00:41:48.916 --> 00:41:54.873
The duck, it was delicious the next day and the dog got a good experience.

00:41:54.873 --> 00:41:57.978
And so we're blessed here in Colorado with a lot of areas to recreate in.

00:41:59.862 --> 00:42:04.516
But it has to be managed properly, not only for wildlife, but the trails have to be managed properly.

00:42:04.516 --> 00:42:12.719
You just can't have walking trails with electric bikes on them and motorcycles on them and ATVs on them and everybody that's in the outer doors wants a piece of the pie.

00:42:12.719 --> 00:42:15.114
And that's the challenge.

00:42:15.114 --> 00:42:30.518
With the Wildlife Commission and the Bureau of Land Management and the Forest Service and the Parks and Wildlife Commission and all the staff, how are you going to balance all this out for everybody to enjoy, whether're hunters or non-hunters?

00:42:30.518 --> 00:42:32.641

The Mick & Pat Show - Mountain Spirit with Paul Navarre Part 1

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