The Mick and Pat Show: Breaking Down the Implications of Gun Taxes, the Politics of Power, and the Consciousness of the Cosmos
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Could your right to bear arms be threatened by a 1000% tax? This week, we address the issue of the Congressional proposal on increasing tax on AR 15s and magazines, and the potential ripple effects it could have across the nation. We explore the possible financial burden this could impose on the less affluent. Exposing the gap between those in power and everyday people, we explore how this disconnect can lead to misunderstandings and potential misuses of power.
As we move along, hold on to your seats as we dive into the thrilling and risky world of high stake poker games, sports betting apps and the impact of indulging in too many movies.
Ever pondered about the consciousness of the universe and the intersection of faith with philosophical concepts? We wrap up this episode, musing on these profound concepts and discussing how politicization of science and misinterpretation of COVID data can lead to misinformation. As we draw to a close, we take a moment to appreciate you, our listeners, and the diverse perspectives you bring. So, buckle up, open your mind, and join us on this enlightening journey.
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Do you think that gun companies like when that happens, at least in the short term?
Speaker 2:Oh, for sure. That's why I don't want to buy Springfield products anymore. Do they always?
Speaker 1:push scare propaganda and then hike their prices up.
Speaker 2:So Springfield is in Illinois. That's where it's headquartered. Let me just get my facts straight here. Actually, while I'm getting the music pulled up, are we recording right now?
Speaker 1:It's rolling.
Speaker 2:It's rolling Okay. Usually, I think of that in terms of cameras and since we have cameras, I just thought you meant the cameras, the cameras.
Speaker 1:This was not rolling when you before, when you were saying you want to overthrow the government.
Speaker 2:I just. I said no such thing, Patrick. Greg, while I'm getting the music pulled up, I'll pull up all the cases of Springfield being anti-2A, but essentially in. You know, pat, just feel free to pull this music backwards Once you get started. I guess. What do you? How do you do that in the recording studio, like, if I'm talking and the music's not live, do you wait to turn the music on until?
Speaker 1:I'll sometimes I'll loop it back and sometimes I'll let it play out in reality of how it happens Got you it's like. It's like my creative expression, my little ways to you know.
Speaker 2:I appreciate if you expressed creatively less. Yeah, I think we got a level of music music's on, I just don't think it's actually coming through. Thanks, craig, for telling us that. There we go Again. White bat audio, 80s action thriller playlist. Gosh, he just makes good music, man. Some like this is Patrick Bates stuff. You know Patrick Bates, american Psycho, christian Bale yeah, he's dancing.
Speaker 1:Like dancing.
Speaker 2:And, like just going over, like the details, I would love to see a remake with like AI, of Patrick Bates just talking about white bat audio before he kills Jared Leto.
Speaker 1:What are you looking at, bro? Well, I was making sure that camera wasn't focused. We've been having some camera focus issues.
Speaker 2:We've been just having issues. That's just the show you know, what I mean Like the show is just we bring in a new feature to it and it doesn't work.
Speaker 1:It's because Craig has no thumbs and so focusing a camera it's hard to grip it.
Speaker 2:That's not true. See, when you say stuff like that, people don't think he's real. Craig has thumbs.
Speaker 1:He just Craig wiggle him around. That's why there's no spaces in the words when he types us emails and memos, because he doesn't have that, that spacebar action.
Speaker 2:Bro, I did see a guy with no hands do a really clean pistol drill. Oh yeah, yeah, he has like the most insane hole, yeah.
Speaker 1:Have you done? Talking about that, I saw that video. Yeah, we watch the same stuff. The algorithm has his peg, but yeah, he has that weird like molded stump mold. He shoves the stump in and he can. He's fast.
Speaker 2:And it, it's, it's, it's a brace. Honestly you know what I mean? It's a brace. Then he uses the other, like nub, to hit the trigger and he has like a really clean firing, like competition shooting 1911. So like, yeah, it looks like a, it looks like a crazy decked out, staccato, and then you know, that thing has like no recoil, anyways, just smooth as butter. So all right, here's the thing. So what we were talking about, I don't know, you got to trim it up, yeah, you got to trim this up, but what we were discussing was how Congress announced just the other day that they want to have a 1000% tax on AR 15s and magazines, which, again, like I don't get what they think that would do, since AR 15s are, you know, you're so not likely to be killed by an AR 50, like someone using the AR 15, you're more likely, like thousands of percentages points, like more likely to be shot and killed by a handgun.
Speaker 1:If you're thinking of like firearm deaths, and wouldn't everybody just switch to buying another platform? The rise of the AK in the West.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Like 1000% tax on AR 15 and use here to like the like like scar.
Speaker 1:Scar is not AR.
Speaker 2:No, but what was the legendary Russian like priest Rasputin? Oh, yeah, like you just seem like that bill gets passed. You just hear Rasputin echoing up from all across the country as Americans just switched to all the Soviet guns, anyway. So they think that would do something. It wouldn't do anything. But it's also like just really inappropriate for the government to put such a heavy tax on something that they don't want people to have but still go around and say like oh, no, no, no, no, you still have that in the Constitution, suffer right to that. Yeah, you still have the right to that. You just have to be able to afford it. And it's just like who do you think can afford that?
Speaker 1:Who's going to suffer from that.
Speaker 2:If let's say, like you know, the cheapest ARs that you can probably get today 500 bucks ish, Maybe yeah like, but just for easy math 500 bucks. Well, what's a 100% tax on that? That's going to be another 500 bucks. So that's at a thousand dollar AR. A thousand percent tax on that is going to put you at $5,000 for the cheapest AR. Think about, like your Gucci tier ARs that are still within, like, everyone's budget as long as you pinch. Like if you want a Daniel defense you know probably the most overpriced entry level AR but still like it's a Daniel defense and it's going to run smooth as butter. You know it's a reliable weapon. If you want to get one of those, like right now, I think, like if you're getting it pre-built off the website, it's like 1600. So it goes to a $16,000 AR, yeah, but then perspective, if you have the right license, a SOT license- you can get machine guns right now for cheaper than that.
Speaker 1:You can get like machine guns for 10 grand. And those aren't even. Those aren't ARs? So we could get those. Everybody's going to start buying machine guns.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'll just get my SOT and I'll just get a machine gun, and then they'll be like wait, this backfired. Everyone's got Mac 10s now Hold up, but anyway. So that led us then to discussing something else how do we get on the Springfield armory? What led us all the way to the Springfield armory?
Speaker 1:Because what I said was do you think gun companies, when they hear something like this, the murmurings of something like a thousand percent tax getting passed in the government or things like they're going to take your guns away, do gun companies get a little bit excited about that, especially in the short term? For those, the next quarterly report.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I think they definitely do, because they know anytime that kind of stuff comes out there's one, they have time, like gun companies have time to stop that and lobby against it. Two, in the meantime, they're going to send out as many emails to their followers of like, get it before it's gone. You know what I mean. Or donate so we can help fight which I get it. If you want to see stuff change in government, you got to spend money. That's the bottom line. I personally don't donate any money to gun groups. There are groups that I pay a subscription to that. I know, part of that subscription probably goes to lobbying for gun rights, which I'm fine with. I don't donate to the NRA or anything like that, not that saying you shouldn't or whatever. I really don't care, it's your money. But I think those groups, like those firearm companies, really do enjoy the quick panic and they get a definitely boost in it, which is how Springfield got into hot water, because several times they've had a history. I'm trying to see if I can sort through this long page that it crakes in over but essentially Springfield had an association as well as Rock River Arms. Both are headquartered in Illinois. Ifma Illinois Firearms Manufacturers Association received an exemption to a law that small dealers who sell less than 10 guns per year oh wait, no sorry, that's the exemption that was given to Springfield. Okay, hold on. But essentially a gun dealer licensing act in Illinois came into policy that was going to basically require that all Illinois firearms dealers be licensed at a federal level as well as a state level. And the state level is where Illinois because all firearm dealers are federally licensed in the whole nation If you sell guns, you're federally licensed. But at the state level is where they can make it real difficult. They can make it like going through hoops and they can, just it can be a shallow issue, and so that's where they were going to make everything a pain in the ass. But then they had an exemption, like if you sell less than 10 guns per year, you're exempt. And then so they gave that exemption status to Springfield and Rock River and it really looked pretty crony-ish, like Springfield Arms and the companies who fund this firearms manufacturer association withdrew their protests of the bill in order to get that exemption, and so it looked very like I don't know, just cronyish that like Springfield. And rather than putting their foot down and being like, no, you can't do this, this is wrong. Illinois was essentially like oh well, we'll give you an exemption, you can still sell all the guns you want in Illinois, your home state, but you can't protest the bill. And it's just like dude, what it that's the most like roll over, weenie thing that a gun company could do? Because it's like. It's like, think about this. It's like, it's like a if you want to flip it to another thing, it's like a anti-cigarette campaign. And then a tobacco company was like whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, man, well, we'll, we'll. We'll stop protesting, we'll stop I don't know Whatever, we'll stop trying to work against your lobby for non-smoking as long as you give us an exemption that we can still sell cigarettes. And it's just like you're not really helping your cause here, right? You're not really helping your, your, your, your market. It's pretty. It's pretty wet sandwichy, or like any of your arguments you've ever made about the.
Speaker 1:Second Amendment being something that is a way that you justify the way you make your living. Now you're making it an exclusive. You know you're taking in and you're altering what the Second Amendment says, making it exclusive. We're really only. You know the haves can do it, not have nots, and so yeah, and that was like that's interesting because I've been so not about Springfield for so long I forgot that was why.
Speaker 2:But like, I literally just turned into Kermudge and where I was like, yeah, I don't buy Springfield stuff, you can't remember why. Yeah, but they did something that really irked me, yeah, and I stopped supporting them and I sold. I sold my XD to someone else to you know be their first firearm, mm hmm, and so I don't own any Springfield products anymore. But anyways, take that. Yeah, Also what are your thoughts on? Like this whole 1000% taxing, like let's just think about it too, like if it was any other freedom underneath the Constitution, like a 1000% tax to you know essentially be on social media and have you be part of, like a freedom of speech domain, a public speech domain. You know what I mean.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it's, yeah, it's using sneaky ways to essentially take away rights, and so the Listen here, poor, we're putting a 1000% tax on cars?
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're not saying you don't have to pay for it. Cars yeah, we're not saying you don't have the freedom to travel at your leisure.
Speaker 1:We're putting a 1000% tax on gas cars.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know like exactly.
Speaker 1:Electric cars are fine. 1000% tax on gas vehicles.
Speaker 2:So either walk like a poor person, or just buy an electric car, or if you're really wealthy, then get a gas car, like you know the rest of us senators and congressmen, do you know what I mean?
Speaker 1:Just straight up, h1.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I don't do. They just drive me up the freaking wall. Yeah it's ridiculous.
Speaker 1:And I, just like all these people, live in a Fantasy world Like what they do.
Speaker 2:You know, the current president in chief is completely he's in his own senile. Sorry, he's completely not senile, you know he's completely fine in his own mind like completely right of health. Yeah, you know, I mean, it's an illusion, it's a circus, when you see him kind of perform around him.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and the and someone told me this way too just like you know someone who's never went to the store and bought a gallon of milk, because about a private chef, like pretty much their whole life like, or have never driven a car because they have a private car Like a private driver, like Just those sorts of things remove you so far from your people. Yeah, that is, you are unrelatable, yep, and I would say too like.
Speaker 2:I just want to say this because I've talked to a couple of people share the podcast excuse me with a few new listener groups and I told them was like we try to be apolitical and I know this sounds political, but really like I don't think it is political. I think this is all very pretty Like bipartisan and like, if you just look at it, it's core, like does it make sense for Demont Democratic Republic that it has these rights enshrined in it, regardless of what your political beliefs are? It doesn't make sense that only the wealthy should be able to afford firearms. Look man, that sounds pretty futile. That sounds pretty like no peasant, you can own a gun, you just need to be able to afford one. Yeah, give us a kidney. Yeah, you know what I mean, and it's just like. It just sounds like to me so not like I think Democrats, republicans, anyone who's a firearm owner should be able to look at this and be like. That is not okay. That's incredibly tyrannical to essentially start blocking people away from access to basic rights through paywalls, because even if you're at the point where you've just said you know because even if you're at the point where you've decided, like for gun violence in America, that you're like, yeah, just do it.
Speaker 1:Do it, do whatever it takes. Then just apply the slippery slope stuff to giving that sort of power over one of what other things could be that applied to, like you know, cars, housing, food, freedom of speech. Freedom of speech, you know, especially. You go all right, like, same thing for you Red meat lovers out there, or whatever. Or if you love kale, let's just say you love kale, and then whoever's in office decides that, like you know, the harvesting of kale is immoral, so therefore we are going to tax it a thousand percent. That's whatever you want to, you know. However you want to play it out, you end up just once again handing over more power from the people.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and it's. It's like I just don't get the logic of the government needs to do something and make it harder to get guns. Also, though, the government is tyrannical and I don't trust it and it oppresses people, and we need to be, we need to have the ability to defend ourselves from the agents of the government, and I'm just like do you hear yourself like that was, like you believe all of that? Do you hear what you're saying? Cause it's like the same people who are like anti police that vote for a thousand dollar percent tax on civilians owning firearms, and I'm just like then who's going to have ARs? Only police, aren't those? The people who you're saying are need to be abolished because of how violent they are.
Speaker 1:It always falls, but it always seems to fall back in on itself.
Speaker 2:Yeah Well, and like here's, here's the bottom line. Again, I don't want it to be political. I think, like you know my comment about president Biden, I do think that is apolitical. I feel like I've met just about any Democrat or Republican I've spoken to. All have had the same concern of his health and his faculties of mind and the fact that he is an oversight.
Speaker 1:He's got a committee that keeps him in check, hopefully right, or even the fact that, like if you ask anybody this simple thing, did you vote for him or against the other guy? The vote was against the other guy.
Speaker 2:Yeah, definitely I definitely knew a lot of people who were like gosh, I will never vote for Trump, but, damn it, I'll never vote for Biden. And I was like so who'd you vote for? And they're like I voted for Biden.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I was like okay.
Speaker 2:Like look man, I'm not like free country, vote for wherever you want. I'm not going to judge you for it, but it is kind of weird how that quickly fell apart.
Speaker 1:I'm not going to judge you for it, but it will blame you for the for where our country is. Well, I'm not going to even blame them for that too, Because like I don't even think.
Speaker 2:Yeah, here's the biggest thing. I'm so not in faith of most. I don't have a lot of faith in the institutions at the highest level in regards to like how not a dog and pony showed is, and so not saying it was rigged or anything like that. But I really can't. I just don't like see like the ability to blame a person for presidential policy.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Like, if I look like I can never blame my neighbor for presidential policy, I'm like, yeah, you voted for him, but look how that turned out and, like you know, in their mind it's like I didn't know he was going to do that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you know, yeah, yeah, cause how much it's hard to know how much power the individual actually has in the whole deal.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and I feel like you know, all governments would rather have the populist pointing fingers at each other than at the government, you know.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:Definitely. But all that said I know that was that was if you want to be political, that was a very libertarian I would say segment. There I wouldn't even say I wouldn't even say I'm libertarian, but I am. I try to be as apolitical as possible and just approach these things from an objective viewpoint of preserving democracy, preserving a democratic republic, you know so.
Speaker 1:And also I just have a real bad habit. It's a real bad habit where I just look at my phone and usually watch whole movies every night while I'm falling asleep bro.
Speaker 2:That was my bad habit when I was in like high school. When Netflix came out of high school I got on my phone. I was like this is going to be a disaster for my second semester senior year.
Speaker 1:This hasn't like always been a habit. This has like been like within the last like year maybe. Yeah, and it's, it's killing me.
Speaker 2:What movies are you watching, bro? Why aren't we doing bruising reviews of these movies? If you're watching?
Speaker 1:one a night I watched like every. Sometimes I'll just what I'll do to it's like because you know you can get stuck on not picking something. Yeah, so for one, like for a while straight, I just did like Liam Neeson movies every night. If it was a Liam Neeson movie, I watched it. Just boom, boom, boom. I just was hitting them all, just getting them all done?
Speaker 2:Do you think you get taste in movies is getting better because you're exposed to so many bad things? I think your taste is getting watered down and you're like that one wasn't as bad.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think it's. It improves my ability to actually like critique a movie, but it degrades my ability to enjoy a movie. You know to just be like. Oh yeah, I like that. I enjoyed that.
Speaker 2:I've had a real good habit recently of when I get in bed. This has been the routine for like probably the last month now. Maybe two months just because of these Western books I'm listening to on audible when I get in bed. I put the Western book on on 45 minute timer, so it's you know. It stops playing after 45 minutes.
Speaker 1:Nice.
Speaker 2:And I play one hand or two hands of poker.
Speaker 1:Dude, I can't do that either, because I've also have another dirty habit, rotten habit. Here's what I do first YouTube shorts for like an hour in bed, and then poker For like an hour and a half. Are we on the same?
Speaker 2:poker app and then poker offline.
Speaker 1:No, I'm on the world series of poker bro.
Speaker 2:Get off of that. Get on poker offline. It's the hardest we could play together.
Speaker 1:No dude cuz here's.
Speaker 2:I can play poker together bro.
Speaker 1:I, I thought about this. I was like I'm pretty sure I could have, like I could develop a gambling addiction. It's not real money, I know, but I know but the the emotional impact.
Speaker 2:It has on me dude like.
Speaker 1:I know, dude, we're just like. Here's what happens every time you go in and you I Usually, like you know you're warming up a couple hands go up, triple your money at least, and then you start. Then you start betting on all. You just bet everything, because now you just have money to spend.
Speaker 2:Yeah, Then you end up with zero. I I started at like Whatever the game starts. I think it's like 200,000 chips. Uh-huh and I've worked up my way to almost 300 mil there it is and my philosophies I just as soon as I go in I just say. If I reach this amount left in hand, or less than that, I'm out. Yeah, I just leave. Like, if, like, if I do, like you know, if I'm like, oh my, my limits 10 grand, mm-hmm, if I go, if I hit 10 grand, then I leave the table. If I go under 10 grand because of a bet, I leave the table and like I, so I do that.
Speaker 1:What if it but? It's from losing money. It always does that. And then you know what the dealer sends me like ace king or whatever You're like. I'm staying in here with these face cards.
Speaker 2:I leave before I look at the cards, you know you gotta get out, you gotta get out fast. But also here's the biggest thing I've learned and all my time in poker.
Speaker 1:You're ace king. It's not. It's the same as a, as a 2-7 in some ways.
Speaker 2:Yeah, your ace king is still gonna get beat by it. Like two pairs you know what I mean. Like the other guys.
Speaker 1:Ace king is gonna whoop your ass. That's the problem. Yeah, dude.
Speaker 2:I forget love poker. I'm so happy you're talking about this, cuz dude, I have been on such a poker grind. But here's the thing I don't, I think, because it's not real money. I don't feel as high when I take it from people, right, I do feel good because I can do like say funny things, mm-hmm, and like when I feel like I am reading it well and I'm baiting them well, that feels really good. But I don't ever really feel like I'm getting Let on or baited into, like losing a lot of money. Some like, most of time, like, well, of course, not any money at all, right, but the, the tokens, the chips in the game, because all I haven't spent any money on. But when I'm playing it and I lose a hand to somebody, I Feel like I'm a pretty good poker player. So I'm at the point now where it's like if I lose, I'm like, oh, that makes sense, mm-hmm, like I. I lost because I thought I had a really solid flush here, mm-hmm, and I totally oversaw a straight. Mm-hmm and that guy had straight in that kind one. So, no worries, no harm, no foul, right, like you put, that was. That's just a better hand and I should have. I should have paid attention. I don't usually get to the point like, yeah, parer, ace, I got a. I got rockets in my pockets. You know state farm, sorry, that's a varma, american Airlines, yeah, and I'm not just like I'm gonna win with this pair of aces and like doesn't matter what anyone else that's cuz I've got a pair of aces. And then cards, you know flop. I'm like I still got a pair of aces. Yeah, I guess. Now I have a pair of threes on the table. Okay, so maybe two pair, and then, you know the, someone wins with three of the kind threes and I'm just like I. Don't, I don't, like, I guess I don't get wrapped up in it because I'm just like I still only have two pair, it doesn't matter what I have like. There's so many other ways to beat that Mm-hmm, so but anyways. I've been into. I just wrote a machine Program not a machine, I guess, but a program that runs as many hands of poker as I want it to run, hmm, and then logs each hand, what one and how many players were at the table playing Mmm and to give.
Speaker 1:That's what changes it up a lot when you're playing with like three people at the table Versus when you have seven. It's it's a different way, different situation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, well, and so I have it running from. I didn't go up past six because I've never been at a table with more than six players. Mm-hmm at least in all the time I've played poker. But I Ran it and I did it 250,000 times for each amount of players to figure out what hand you are most likely to win with. Like More times than not, if there's just you and one other person playing, or you and three other people playing. Whatever you, you know amount of players you want to pick.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:If you get this type of hand, you're gonna win, you know, 35% of the time. Mm-hmm, it was cool because, like you know, at what was it was? At like six players, you have a 35% chance winning with Two pair. Like, if you have two pair, mm-hmm, your odds of winning there, like 35% chance. Now, that doesn't factor into, like, if you have two parents, someone else has a higher two pair, right, it's just that, like, two pairs win 35% of the hands of poker with six players. When you go less down in that they don't win as much. Oddly enough, you know it's got, there's like weird different bumps at like which hand overtakes the other according to the amount of players at the table and the, and it's hard to factor in the. That's where the, the human factor, comes in yeah, I mean because, like, if you, if you try to rationalize an AI to like Understand betting and all that, mm-hmm. Ai's never go for all in right, like some kid just recently won an award. My buddy was telling me this. He saw that this kid won an award for his like AI program that he wrote. He wrote a poker game and they're like that's awesome, you wrote it, ai that wins a hundred percent of the time in this poker game. He's like, yeah, and they're like we're not a hundred percent time, but it wins. It beats all the other bots mm-hmm and they're like how'd you do it? He's like I just wrote it to go all in every time before the cards flop and like you do that. All the other programs that are told to weigh rationality and statistics. They're backed out they always back out because like oh well, my odds of winning with the cards available to me, which are just two out of 50, because it's never like.
Speaker 1:You're never over 50% chance of winning probably never yeah. Like. So like those those bots are like. We have an F minus chance.
Speaker 2:Yeah For currently not going all in and so, like I was just like, yeah, I mean, that's not sophisticated, but that's cool, that's cool that that kid figured that out. That's the way you know AI's think. But so, yeah, I just I really got into it. I would love to play with you, but also not, if you know. So, vice, I don't want it.
Speaker 1:I don't want to get you to a point where, like no, the I took all my money and I just spent 80 thousand dollars.
Speaker 2:I took a mortgage out of my house to buy more chips in this poker game but the no, I think I'm.
Speaker 1:I Like to play poker. My favorite way to play poker is with couple fellas, you know, do a $20 buy-in, sit around, hang out and then, you know, deal them out and with with caps on stuff. Like you know, or You're not, guys aren't throwing their car keys on the table stuff. It's getting wild, you know, it's just yeah, dude, I'm gonna play for money.
Speaker 2:once I was back in, it was back in Mississippi, and Did you think for a second about a real story? I was trying to make it look like I was drifted there. Oh yeah, no, we played for money once. It was same thing $21 buy-in, that's it. And we just decided. Rather than like Doling out chips equal to $20 and change whatever, we are just like look, whoever has the most tips at the end of the night gets the pot. Yep, that's just the easiest way of doing it, and no, like hey man, like I want my $5 and 28 cents back.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, it's none of that crap. I watched the guy lose himself over. We did a $5 buy-in one time and he like had all of a sudden he was like I gotta leave early and we're like it's like too bad, and we're like he's like he's like can you do me out my money. And he had like $2 and 30 cents. You know whatever it was like and it turned into a thing bro.
Speaker 2:That's ridiculous.
Speaker 1:Like, so you could see like it was just like. Oh man, he's being serious. But the best part about that story was he never even paid me for the pizza that night, so I Should have gone hunting him down for that $2 and 30 cents ever hang out with that guy again. Yeah, we saw him out with him, but it was just like because we, here's the deal. It was like it's what was surprising about it was, how surprising was he's just like a nice, calm, like fun dude, like really Gentle person, and then something about the gambling and and money just Flip to switch on. Yeah, weird.
Speaker 2:I would never hang out with anyone like that, ever again not saying that it's wrong for you. But I'm just like, I'm a very quick as soon as I see money become a, an idol or something that you're willing to like lose a relationship sober and like don't get me wrong, yes, if you're like, amen, 200 bucks on here, I'm cashing out. Can I like cash out what I have left?
Speaker 1:right if you're playing big boy games with real Pokemon. Yeah, yeah, let's go like it's like fair right.
Speaker 2:But like I'm just like I'm like, look, dude, I get money's money, and you know you might be at different income levels. So like I respect you know the sensitivity towards it. I've been dirt poor before, you know too. So like I know what it's like to think like, dude, I don't have the money to do this, like I don't think you get it. But if that's the way you feel about money, don't sit at a table to play poker for money With your friends, right, like you're gonna. You're gonna harsh those relationships pretty hardcore pretty quickly. I Don't know. I've only had good experiences, dude. I literally we played poker for like all semester in college once. Mm-hmm, was it a whole year? Might have been a whole year. It was every night. I mean not every night, it was every Tuesday night, I think a. Wednesday night we called it, yeah, stnw same time next week. And the ultimate it was never for money, it was just, you know, for fun and hanging out and get to know, like, Like people in the dorms. But then the thing that it like culminated was at the end of the semester was whoever was the first one out of money in the final game mm-hmm. Had to out were out of trips. In the final game had to get the tattoo of the person who won, oh my gosh, that hand. So out there there is a homie who has a big green poker trip on his butt with the initials of the winner yeah, the initials are QK, green green chip, and I just think is like one of the funniest things, because it was like a dude who was like such a good Sport about it, probably like in like the nicest guy you'd ever meet, just so gentle and soft-spoken. And then the other guy was definitely a nice guy too, but like way more competitive, I think, mm-hmm. And so somewhere out there that like super nice guy, you know, good Christian boy got a big old only tattoo. I think he has maybe maybe as other ones I don't know, but like the only tattoo he had for a locked eye was that. But I mean, it was like the bottom of a soda can like sizes.
Speaker 1:Sideship yeah it's awesome.
Speaker 2:It is not like even like a really clean. Yeah, it looks like that like two-dimensional, just circles, circle lines around the outer circle and then color it. In QK got the discount.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it was just count that that was funny man, the high stakes poker, the Get yourself in trouble fast in the old poker arena.
Speaker 2:Yeah, did you ever play like the wacky, like if you were sit down with someone to play poker in there, like, yes, we're playing a jacks high and a tozer Deuce in the hole and you're just like don't what, yeah. Can we play Texas? Hold them and like no man, this is how we play here and my house, my rules. I'm just like I'm not playing like I just don't play there, I'm just like look, dude, like either you have the patience to tell me that beforehand and teach me the rules before I sit down, or Like I'm just not gonna play, I'm just I'm just because I don't want to get competitive and feel cheated out of, like me, not knowing the rules. Now, if you're go, if you're going somewhere and they have house rules and it's for money, you better know. Yeah, like if I sit down and throw his if it and expect the dealer to teach you the house rules you know when you're playing for money, but because if it's in my friend, I'm gonna be like Dude. Why didn't you tell me like what is this weird, nonsensical rule stuff? You gotta explain it.
Speaker 1:That's actually my favorite way to. I love to teach poker to people and so we'll get through it. The way we do it as you Dealer chooses the game, so the game's changing all night long. So if you're playing for no money, people have chips and it's people learning how to play poker.
Speaker 2:How do you know? How did the different rules? I don't even know any other rules than the rules.
Speaker 1:Yes, there's. There's just there's different styles, different ways of play, so different. Like the most simplest way, it would be like we play different games. You play Texas, hold them. You play seven card stud. Play five card stud. Five card draw. And those are, those are all, those are all the same, like you know, pair beats Beats a high card, two pair beats one pair, like that's still all. The it's just the way they get dealt and when you bet is different. So so I teach, so we do that and we I teach them how to bet each other's games, because I think it's important for Fellow to know you should be able to sit down like a card table and just kind of at least be able to hang and not not feel like you're Totally out of place of. Anyways, you play, play and these days, in this day and age, everybody just plays straight up. Texas, hold them, that's just so good it's, I know it, that's like. But you got to know a couple other games, and so the because all the guys who complain a lot about switching up the game, I think, or because they don't really know how to play the other games and they get kind of like they're like no, dude, we're gonna play, hold them, we play, hold them, it's like what's our. So, anyways, we learn the games. So I take everybody through the games, then we play see, I just don't know any of the other rules.
Speaker 2:I like I don't know what seven card stud is, so if you're like, oh, can we play seven card stud? I'd be like, if you want to teach everybody.
Speaker 1:That's what I do. We like we teach everybody the whole night, so then you can go go play something else. Then we play a game called guts, which gets real wild. I've heard of that, never seen, and then we play a game called baseball, which involves wild cards and stuff, and it gets crazy fast. And then my favorite thing to do at the end of the night Is we play blackjack and I'm the dealer and we just sit there and we're talking and we're playing for, like you know, for another 25 minutes money.
Speaker 2:Well, you take all the chips, yeah this.
Speaker 1:So this is all. When we're doing this, we're doing no real money. Yeah and so by the end of like, after just hanging out talking, we're just, you know, we get all done and like with a couple hands and I say, all right, everybody, look at your, look at your hands, you know. Look at your, your pile of chips, right, and they look down like I look at my pile of chips. They look at me and I'm just like so you never play like Jack, don't play this don't play this if you go out.
Speaker 2:Never play blackjack. It'll get you your play Indian poker.
Speaker 1:Oh yeah.
Speaker 2:See, I think Indian poker is the ultimate stakes. Oh yeah, poker is where just the man are made the cowboy stay down forged.
Speaker 1:Yeah, just right on there. I Know what you got. You're just in here, do I?
Speaker 2:know what I got Questions did I see it in the mirror?
Speaker 1:of the bar. Yeah, exactly, and you're just looking around and it's it, that's. You're just all weighing out the different people's facial expressions, idiot poker so good.
Speaker 2:You know, like there, once you realize what Indian poker is, like the first hand, you're playing it and you realize, okay, wait, so what's going on here? We're betting on what we think ours is and if we can trump everything. And you're looking around, you're looking at everybody else looking at cards and they're looking at yours and you're like there's a lot of high cards out there. Then you're like, oh shit, yeah. Oh yeah like it feels good when you're playing a idiot bunker. You're like, okay, two, four, seven, nine, all right, I'm looking good.
Speaker 1:I'm looking good.
Speaker 2:King Queen, jack King, ace, ace, ace a bone. It's pretty fun though.
Speaker 1:It's good you got to know how to play the old, the old poker.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I I did. I did see a guy once at a ren fair who actually had professionally traveled into or doing like that's on five finger filet. Hmm, what I think of a lay is just like the like who can match and do the longest like.
Speaker 1:Don't do your fingers.
Speaker 2:Oh yeah, the game yeah, and you got to keep up Uh-huh With the other person without poking your fingers and like most people are, like most people are bad at it and not quick, so like it's pretty easy to stay in pace with each other before someone pokes their finger.
Speaker 1:Uh-huh.
Speaker 2:Because then it's like oh, we're matching each other over matching each other. Okay, I'll go a little bit quicker. Oh, they're going a little bit quicker, oh gosh. And then someone cuts himself right. Mm-hmm, do to know, five finger filet can just go. Do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, without looking like down at it and no one can keep up with them. And then, when it's really them, you know, they keep going until a hand, until they poke a hand, poke a finger.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:I mean the bets get like pretty high. Oh like I do remember seeing his hands.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:His hands had a lot of freaking scars.
Speaker 1:Oh, I guess fingers.
Speaker 2:Fingers look like someone chewed on them. You know what I mean Like just like the divots of scar tissue over years and years of doing it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, but the trick is you get going real fast and just Just fast as you can to be outside your fingers. Yeah, you fast enough that people will notice that you're not really getting it done. Interesting, you know, just cheat. Interesting, that's that's, that's the method there. That's how a kid once we're doing in middle school and he's with a pencil specially sharpened pencil, and Went in there, let the pencil lead, went just all the way in the finger and just snapped off and then we're just like oh Time to be done with that.
Speaker 2:I think the real way I've heard of it, like played, is like one person Starts on a bet, mm-hmm, and you have to follow their pattern and you and you alternate patterns that have to get like one step further. And then, like you, either you either make you make a mistake on the pattern and that person gets your bet, like they get the pot, or you cut yourself and that person gets a pot.
Speaker 1:Hmm, and you're trying to do as fast as you can so they don't see, so they're kind of forget.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so you go, let you go like start between thumb index and you go thumb pinky and index middle ring, middle index thumb out, and you just go Like quicker than they're like oh shit, you know. Hmm that'd be fun. Just kidding, I don't. I would like if I ever walked into a bar and I saw guys play five finger flay, I wouldn't go. I do like the classic like what's this? What's the dead on the Simpsons? Not Homer, but his dad. Oh, I can't remember his name. But he just like see where he walks into a bar, puts his hat on the hook, turns around, grabs his head off the hook, walks out.
Speaker 1:Just in and out. Yeah, yep the uh. If you had a prosthetic, you could really make some money that way, because people be like this.
Speaker 2:Guy doesn't give a care in the world, he's a no, but even if you had a hit in there, if you poke yourself, yeah, but they don't know you poke yourself.
Speaker 1:You don't know you poke yourself, like you know what I mean?
Speaker 2:I don't know. I think they'd be onto the moment you poke yourself the first time and there's no blood, like they say, like like the middle finger and the finger like folds in half From the force floppy. Yeah, anyways, dude poker man, I do love a good game. I'm also like I have a couple friends who are like I love gambling. I love.
Speaker 1:I love Parley. That's on my sports app.
Speaker 2:Yeah. But like I talked to him like what do you? What do you? Do you play text. So I'm like, oh no, dude, I just play craps when I go to the casino. Oh yeah, that's, that is gambling. Like that is like all luck, no Strategy, you know, I mean yeah, I hate that.
Speaker 1:I don't. I haven't spent a lot of time with casinos, but I hate. I feel so Out of place, like I I don't know all the little nuance rules. There's so many things Good. Like a casino, you know, like you're not supposed to touch your hands here, you're not supposed to like grab this card yet, you're not supposed to like you bet at this point. And then there's all these little like. There's just all these little rules to games that just Everybody seems to know. That I just feel like. I feel like I don't. I feel like a middle schooler Trying to break into a ring of kids like talking. That's how I feel the whole time on that casino.
Speaker 2:So I have never played anything at a casino, just because I've never been to one other than to stay the night.
Speaker 1:Hmm.
Speaker 2:I stopped in a casino one night on a late night, driving bad weather.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I was like I just need, I just need a hotel room in and they're like if you uh, if you like, open up your card on file so we could, you could just pull money off your credit card right on to like your you know your card walking around in scanning to grab chips or like scan at slots. If you do that, it's like 50 bucks off the room. I was like sounds good, yeah, and I, they did that. And then I was like, all right, have fun. I was like okay, and I just went upstairs With a discount on the room with I like checked out, nice, it's not a bad way to go. You can get a lot of discounts if you go to the casinos pretty frequently. I mean you can go and they'll just give you free rooms, free food, free drinks. You just you got to go frequently enough to spend like you know that, they know you. I guess you hit up the.
Speaker 1:It's because they know they're making it all back on the people who can't say no. Yeah, I had a buddy who wants to. I was like I think I'd be funny to go up to Black Hawk sometime and gamble whatever. And he's like I can't. And I was like why not? He's like no, dude, I just like I seriously can't. Like I'll empty out my bank account, wow. And he was like I can't do it. I was like what if we just bring cash and you like leave your cards, you know. And like he's like no, I will. Like he's like I will find a way to get my money and I will spend it.
Speaker 2:I was like all right, I get it Like I get that. I don't. I've just never felt that way about gambling, ever. You know what I mean. And I've also just like I don't know if I've ever met anyone personally that I was addicted to gambling. I've met people who are bad at it. Yeah, and like they lose money, but I've never met anyone who wasn't able to say no and stop spending money.
Speaker 1:The. I think I worry about the sports betting apps.
Speaker 2:How many guys out there are just now have closeted gambling addictions Because definitely know a lot of guys who are doing sports betting several times a day.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and like I just think I bet there's tons of dudes out there who are getting themselves either one way in a hole and way in a bad place, or just like wasting tons of money and they won't realize till they, you know, look at their statements at the end of the year, whatever. But the because you used to have to. Either you know you had to go to a place, place a bet, don't pay it the bookie comes and finds you with his friends, you know. Or like go to a casino or go to a sketchy, like back alley, crap shoot, you know, and see if you could win some money or whatever if you had to scratch the itch. But now it's just like on your phone, right there, Just you can just tap the button.
Speaker 2:Have you looked into that thing where it's essentially like you can't lose but you don't win a lot? It's a type of betting on the sports apps where you look at the odds that they have for one side of the bet. So you know, I'm just going to simplify it but like Broncos versus Patriots, and on one app you bet that Broncos will win and they have an odds return. You know you bet this much. This is how much money you'll make if you bet on it, right? I can't remember what it's called. It's not called like favor or something like that. But then you look at another app or another you know website and they have better odds for the Patriots or something like that, right? And then you can put it in a calculator. There's like certain calculators that are out there where you just put in the odds for each one and your amount of money that you're willing to put on, and it tells you what to put on which one, so that way you don't lose any money. You will make money or you won't lose any money at all. But when you do it that way, you're not making a lot of money, right? Because you're always accepting like I'm going to eat costs, like I'm going to spend money and potentially win it all back, or I'm going to spend money and win a little bit, because I'm still having to spend it to get a little bit back out. And usually like someone's done the math and like there's guys who are doing that is just like a full career and all they're doing all day. They don't know anything about sports, they don't know anything about boxing, they just know math. They just they just use the calculator and they just play stuff all day and at the end of it you win all that. And the thing that really kills some of these guys is the taxes they have to pay on winnings versus what you would pay on a salary. I was about to say that.
Speaker 1:So these guys.
Speaker 2:they start doing it and they realize, oh my gosh, I literally need to do this every day for eight hours a day in order to make enough money after taxes to like maintain my quality of life. You know what I mean. And so, like some guys though, like I mean, they say, you know you essentially earn like six to 10% on a year, like essentially everything, like every transaction averages out to like six to 10% interest on it. You know that you're winning back, but you also, like you know that's averaged out, so like that includes all the times when you don't win anything, you just win your money back. I was like, that's pretty cool, I'm interested in it. I can't remember what it's called. It's not like hedged betting, but it's something like that.
Speaker 1:Right, you can hedge your bets in other ways, but this is like a, this is a whole nother level of that, and even though it's not illegal, you have to usually use two different apps and different bank accounts you can't do it all on the same phone.
Speaker 2:You have to do it on an app. You could do like an app on your phone, but then you have to do an app on a different device and usually try to like use a VPN, because these betting websites use cookies to track you when you go to other websites and if they see patterns of hedge betting, then they they just ban you from the platform, even though it's not illegal. They just say, hey, you can't do that anymore. You're here, we're not going to let you use our platform anymore, which is like so dumb In my opinion. It's like yeah, you mean someone's kind of winning money every time and I'm winning a lot, but whatever.
Speaker 1:Anyways.
Speaker 2:I just always thought that was cool and interested in. You know warrants looking into you if you're looking for another way of like making some money in your downtime. But that's not like the type of betting I know from sports apps that most of my friends are doing. Most of my friends are like not doing that stuff. They're like straight up, like I guess they're way more sports guys Then, like most people, like they know a lot about sports, so I guess they they are making decently informed decisions, but it's still a big gamble.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean.
Speaker 2:Like odds on a sports team performing to the level of a bet is way different than the likelihood. The next card flipped over is going to be a like a heart, and you're going to have a flush.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean. Yeah.
Speaker 2:The card is a constant and does not change the odds. No matter how long the day goes on until that card has flipped, the odds remain the same. You know what I mean. And like there's this one where it's like, did he eat the right breakfast? Yeah, is that guy going to sprain an ankle, run in, is he going to step wrong and, you know, his knee going to get blown out before I reach the touchdown. It's just like all that stuff is way more up in the air. Oh, yeah, and I feel like that's really gambling.
Speaker 1:You know, like you're you are gambling.
Speaker 2:at that point You're not betting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're just making a seemingly informed decision. And then there's just some guys who just are really good at it, whatever it is. They're good at blackjack or they're good at, like, sports playing.
Speaker 2:They're just like, I think, the blackjack you could be good at, as long as you could keep track of cards.
Speaker 1:Yeah, sometimes I think luck is a thing. I don't think it's thing. I think some guys are lucky man, I think some guys are, I don't know.
Speaker 2:You know what the, what the deal is, I think that's way more about body language than it is Actual odds. Like I just don't think people I don't believe in, like I really don't believe in luck. I do believe in like statistics and I believe like when someone is statistically out of odds, we interpret that as luck. But dude, statistics exist to give you the best likelihood of something occurring or not occurring, and sometimes some individuals, I think, just run into a lot of things occurring that are very unlikely, whether good or bad, you know. And so to the rest of us, we just recognize that like wow, that's outside the norm. Like that is beyond what the average person experiences. We call it luck or unlucky.
Speaker 1:You know what I mean, yeah.
Speaker 2:And that is like not dude, like when you, when you, when you look at the equation for like the odds you'll die in a plane crash versus the odds you're killed by debris falling from space, you would say, wow, how unlucky that guy died from getting hit by like satellite debris. You'd be like, what are the odds who? I've never met anyone hit by satellite debris. You've also probably never met anyone who died in a plane accident. But you, you would think plane crashes are way more likely than dying from debris falling from space falling from the atmosphere.
Speaker 1:I got in a plane accident, lost his legs but he's still making it. He's crawling away from that thing. It's burning. He's crawling away and then just a little bit of satellite through the brain pan. You're like that is unlikely.
Speaker 2:That's statistically those things happening at the same time and like this close of it. We would call that unlucky, but in a universe of infinite possibilities, that is definitely for sure something that could happen. You know, I mean like that's why. That's why I kind of I don't know, I think that's kind of like statistics, so like they kind of ruin the way you view that stuff because you just realize you're like I don't know, it's also the same thing I look at, like I mean, it's also part of the reason why I look at like biblical miracles and stuff as miracles rather than statistics. It's because there are some things that happening like that we've recorded in history that have occurred. We're like, wow, that is so unlikely. The odds of all those happening are like you know, someone doing that Like a big one is who's the guy who essentially predicted like the Twin Towers and the war in the middle, like the?
Speaker 1:you know, the Notre Dame Notre.
Speaker 2:Dame, yeah, there are the odds of like a lot of his things being true and coming true as he predicted them are pretty low. But also you look at all of his predictions that aren't true.
Speaker 1:Right. And you're like okay, it kind of averages out actually.
Speaker 2:But then, like I view stuff that is like miraculous, biblically speaking, I'm like okay that that shouldn't happen. Like some guy, this mathematician, did the odds of essentially the time, like the time difference between Old Testament prophecies and Jesus Christ fulfilling those, and not just that he would fulfill the ones you know, like if fulfill the Old Testament prophecies that he did while he was here on earth, but that he would even be able to do them with the way geopolitical things change over time or environmental changes, right, like we're talking, like some of these predictions came out when the Jews were fleeing Egypt. What are the odds that there would be an Israel for Jesus to be in where they were? Like you know, they're predicting like there's going to be like these things happen here and he will do these things. And it's like well, that requires like so many different factors to occur, such as, like in Israel to exist where the Jews live, where they are currently under the oppression of, not Egypt but a foreign government. And it's just like all those things, like the likelihood of all those happening at the same time for one lifetime to do in a window of 33 years is so crazy small that, like statistically, we define other things as miracles when they're far more likely. When they're about a trillion times more likely, we would say they're still a miracle. Like the odds that Jesus did all those things in a lifetime is like trillions of impossible, like the likelihood of those all aligning. So that's why we, like people, define those mathematically as miracles, because there's other things we define as miracles that are way more likely. They're all still way less than 0% Well, not less than 0%, but they're less than 1%, half a percent. But there are certain things that we were like wow, that was a miracle and it was 1,000th of a percent occurring. And then the odds that Jesus would do the things he did and be able to fulfill those prophecies was insane. It's something unreasonable. I can't remember it, but it was like the comparison of the figure was like something to the umpteenth power yeah, there's more stars in the universe than there are, like I mean, there's fewer stars than there is zero between the decimal point and like the number for like the percentage. So I was just kind of like okay, well then, as a mathematician, statistician, how do you argue with that? Yeah any who know, because I get. I get pumped about statistics.
Speaker 1:No, I guess, and I think that in the biblical apologetics, like conversation, it's people want to divide For some reason. There's this whole thing where it's like it's science versus like religion or science versus like Christianity, but never made sense to me. But it's like the really, if you're from a standpoint of believing that it was created, it's like the science. So when someone's like, the first thing someone say about this would be like well, what's your evidence? Like you never. Like taking my picture of God, or like no one's ever like recorded, like you know his existence or whatever. But it's like, but the just, the very. I think science speaks to the fact that there's a creator. Science speaks to I think it's one and the same. It's not, it's not a versus thing to one to like disprove the other and as in one from the like maybe atheist camp or whatever that wants to try to combat science. That's, that's one thing. That's one thing I have a problem with. But the bigger thing I have a problem with would be like Christians who won't and science who won't. Engage science, yeah, because the if you believe God created it, then it's worth working through understanding how it worked, because it's very existence of whatever that thing is is within his domain, so well and, like the, you know, there's now a leading conversation in science Now saying this is what majority scientists believe, right?
Speaker 2:now so science is such a fickle domain that, like, I'm very careful to say like science is a, you know, a umbrella term because there's a lot of people that say trust the science. There's a lot of scientists who have been saying, yeah, but what you say is science is not science. You know what I mean. Like what you say is science is kind of political and politicized for an agenda. You know word vomit and if you want to follow science then we should be willing to ask questions and look for the answers and those questions. So I'm really careful with like saying like I don't, I don't believe. Like in saying like trust science. But I would say, like, as a Christian, I do not believe you should be content with and I know this is going to like probably like get some people's fires started, right, and I hope it does. I don't think you should be content by simply reading Genesis and saying that is all the evidence you need that the world was created in you know, six days or whatever, and evolution isn't real. I think like to have faith in that is good, like that's fine, like I I believe God created the world and everything around it, right, but there you should examine the other side's argument against creationism. Right, like you should examine it and be willing to examine it and be willing to hear it and listen to it and be willing to attempt to understand the science, because for me, I was anti Bible coming from a point of Christianity. Well, coming at Christianity from a point of like evolution, I believe evolution it makes more sense than the idea of like this magical fairy tale guy creating the world in the universe. Right, and I actually felt very kind of floor came out from under me the more I like went deeper into the science of like evolution and more I got into the arguments it makes and assumptions it makes and I felt like there were several points where you had to make some very severe assumptions to really believe that evolution is a valid theory for the existence of intelligent life. I also believe, like Big Bang and what we understand, the universe is always changing and now, like the Big Bang is actually falling out in theory and a lot of popular science like not saying that. A lot of scientists are like, yeah, no, the Big Bang is not true. God created the universe. I'm not saying that at all, but I'm just saying like the Big Bang was this thing that we were all you know, the book was smacked in our heads about the Big Bang and we had exams on it and you were like you're on the pass in the seventh grade by how well you know. Like this course, or like if you flunk it like, you're gonna have to retake this course again next year, right, literally, things that we were taught in school are now being swapped out for like, possibly not true, or being debated whether or not they should even be taught because there could be a different theory that we believe holds more water. And so I just think, like all I said, when we talk about science, you got to be very skeptical of like what does this person mean when they say trust the science? You know, there's a lot of stuff that I see that, like people say trust the science and it's really comes down to like, well, no, just believe, just agree with my political opinion.
Speaker 1:Right and you can it's easy to fudge the numbers on anything and lean things your way.
Speaker 2:Bro, everyone wanted to say trust the science about how I don't care what people think about this one COVID is not as lethal as people thought it was. I know people who died not from COVID and were labeled as COVID deaths. A lot of that has come out. You know, in the year since you know just all the stuff that has come out about COVID, that a lot of people were told to shut up and shame because they're fringe, weirdo conspiracy theorists. And now a lot of them are like dude, I was telling you this three years ago and everyone's just accepting it as truth. Like the science coming out, the real science, the real numbers coming out, you know, with review of like oh, the mask actually didn't do anything. Like masking up really didn't do anything, had no significant impact. You can't see a demonstratable area where it had an impact over an area that didn't mask up. And like, I remember you know I was studying data science to get my you know certification on all that during COVID and there were people who were like we are seeing a huge like significant, and by significant, scientifically significant, greater than a 5% likelihood, I mean greater than a 95% likelihood that masking up is reducing the rate of COVID and it's just like what are you? That's some real confidence, man, that's what you're. You're literally talking about the confidence interval and statistics. You better have the math to back it up. And then now, like it's coming out like no, that math doesn't exist, like it didn't, it didn't, it didn't even appear that way at the time, and I'm just like, hey, man, like you got to be aware of how misconstrued those numbers can be and you got to really ask the hard questions and be willing to examine the argument.
Speaker 1:Right, yeah, because the it's being weaponized and politicized. You know, science engine or whatever, whatever.
Speaker 2:It always has been. Yeah, you know, for as long as like you could, I would argue that, like people, were killed when they said the earth was round. Exactly and like you could, I would argue that science has always been in some form of another, existing and like, back in the day, people who were executed, burning the stake for saying the earth was round and not the center of the universe, and they should be because it is flat, they were. They were executed based on, like, what the popular science was, the popular sciences. Well, no, the earth is the center of the universe because the sun, you know, in the moon, revolve around us, the whole celestial body revolves around us at night and it's like that's clearly the wrong science. But if you just had examined one another's arguments rather than being political about it, probably wouldn't have had this, you know, probably would have gone around to the answer a lot sooner. Right, and that's why I'm always, like, at a big emphasis of like you need to examine each other's arguments rather than, like, just closing your ears and pointing your finger Because, like, that is how you seclude yourself from science, from the scientific method. But anyways, the reason I'm talking about this and like I'm making that as a big pre statement, is because it's becoming way more talked about. It's already been talked about for years, but it's getting way more traction now, according to like with everything we're pulling in from our latest James Webb telescope. Some scientists more, more more scientists are believing that the universe is conscious, that, like the universe itself, is a conscious entity of some kind and, like quantum mechanics and string theory or all gravity, all this is surrounding itself in a way of energy transfer through the universe, and the laws of energy transfer and matter in the universe are simply part of a consciousness that is aging. Mm-hmm and as it ages, we're not sure if it dies, we're not sure if it gets old and senile right, you know, I mean. But, like there's a lot of scientists who are like you know, they're wondering if the universe is conscious and they're asking the question of some people like what the hell are you smoking? It's black space, mm-hmm. You know, 99% of it is empty. Mm-hmm and the rest. It's not like a human brain where, like it's full, you know how much empty space is in your brain, like less than like half a percent. You know I mean, but other people are like I don't know. Man Kind of looks like a brain when we look at like a mapping of essentially the way light travels through the universe between different, like stellar bodies, mm-hmm, and you look at the way that word. Yeah, it looks like yeah, and I think a lot of people have seen that. You know like the universe looks like a brain and you're like, wow, that does kind of look similar. But at the same time you know you have to understand, like how hard it is to probably accept the universe being conscious to people who are Atheistic to be to begin with. You know we're like harshly agnostic to any higher, higher being of intelligence, right, mm-hmm. And so I just thought it was interesting, cuz I'm like how close can they dance to the idea of there being intelligent design without saying it? you know, I mean the universe may be sentient, and it's expansion and direction and I just yeah, what the hell are you saying? Matter knows what it's doing like you're doing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, father. You're gonna get from it you know getting closer to saying, like the big G word, yeah, like whether it's in the Judeo-Christian, like understanding of that word or not, like you're getting Just starting to start an approach, you know have to use that word universe, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 2:Like the Boat. People also say like yeah, I think the universe has its ways, man, it's got its purposes and it's got what it's gonna do for you. I'm like the hell you saying, yeah, why don't just say the God a God like what do you? How is the universe conscious and separate from the consciousness of a divine being?
Speaker 1:Right, and just because you want to separate yourself from what you might see is like you know something as a flawed institution or whatever. Yeah, the just yeah, people will. People will fight tooth and nails and stay away from it, but the science might continue to Push us in a direction where they're gonna have to say something about it well then, like I again like.
Speaker 2:I think it's something that Christians should read. Like this is a scientific argument proposed by non believers that the universe is conscious, and I think it is beneficial to believers to like yes, except that it's all ecclesiasties, except that it's all been said before that there is nothing new under the Sun.
Speaker 1:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 2:Whatever is postulated now has been postulated at another point by another person, and trust in the wisdom of God. Okay, that's my big, you know, christian argument. Is that, ultimately, trust in the wisdom of God, whatever you think tested against scripture? I'm, in my experience, scripture holds up right. But there is a lot of value, I think, to hearing these opinions and hearing these arguments and conversations. So that way you were prepared for, you know, second Timothy or whatever, but being prepared for graceful and gentle response to you know, any arguments that are, you know, set forth by non-believers. And I Genuinely think, like that's how I became a believer, because men were educated, not not saying that there weren't godly women who helped me Become believers, but there was primarily men who had an interest in the beliefs of a non-believer, learned those and then Discussed their beliefs and my beliefs to help answer my questions, right, yeah and so anyways, but I just think it's cool. So check that out, you know, our kin out there, definitely give it a look. The universe itself may be conscious. Also, there's now an argument to that, like people are trying to make sense of how the age of certain things don't make sense in the universe and they're wondering like Kind of looks like some things were just put in certain places at a certain point in time Already in existence. We don't know how they exist there, because everything around them should be older, but it's not. It's like the gravity of this star Should have had this kind of effect on its celestial body over the last, you know, 10 billion years that star has been alive, mm-hmm. However, it looks like it's only been around for a billion years and therefore doesn't add up into our timeline of how we understand stars and the effect of gravity on other celestial bodies. This is like I don't know, man, that kind of sounds like it was put there, like the way you're born, and that kind of sounds like someone dropped it there and left it, and I'm just wondering like how much further you could get close to that without saying it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, there's gotta be some guys out there here just starting to like be like we're gonna have to just say it. I was have to say it, I. And then they just said there's, come out with it and take the criticisms and get burned at the stake.
Speaker 2:Yeah, anyhow, big, big Tangent on the scientific, you know, eschatology.
Speaker 1:Eschatology is the end of end of times. What's the one that's not times? Yeah, educate me, my man, on Just theology.
Speaker 2:What's the two? There's like eschatology as the end of times, and then there's another one that is just the study of. It's not theology. Oh, I know, it's like the justification of faith by observation. Yeah, yeah it's a.
Speaker 1:It's right there, right there in my now. I just have the word hermeneutics stuck in my head. Yeah, it's not that it's a. You have to just look it up. I'm looking for it, alrighty, but the, yeah, maybe it's a, maybe it warrants a more conversation, but the it may be, as it may be, eschatological, as Might be a little bit of eschatology in there. If it's, if we're dealing with an aging universe, like how, if there is a, are we inside of a Joe Biden Brain? You know, it's kind of, you know, hitting the end of its deal, but is the end of its deal like another, like 40 billion years? You know, and do we know anything about it? We're just gonna keep on.
Speaker 2:Ontological is made from a philosophical argument the ontological basis for Faith yes, there it is, the.
Speaker 1:I Feel like I need to Pay more attention to things like like the James Webb telescope stuff and it's it's. There's so many things, new things getting discovered all the time, especially when they start getting into quantum mechanics, string theory, stuff that I I just think I don't have the time to learn it.
Speaker 2:Epistemological reasoning, epista, epistemological. There, reasoning for faith is a reasoning for faith based on Knowledge, like the study. You know, methods, validity, scope. So there's the epistemology onto ontology, ontological in a pistol epistemological.
Speaker 1:And we're something in the entomology, because we're just, we're just in a giant ant ant. With the. I think that We've taken taking a few turns. We've discussed few turns, yeah, you know what is gonna come up here?
Speaker 2:I really did come in just only planning to talk about poker, and here we are yep, we got there.
Speaker 1:The this one I think be coming out like Right at the end of August, beginning of September. We heading into People are getting into the school year. The fall rhythm it's been cooling off this week already. It's gonna keep on. Maybe it will probably a few more hot weeks. But then I Head into fall my football people out there getting excited about it. Hmm, I need. I wish I could get excited about football again.
Speaker 2:I just I have a you've been hurt too many times I think that all sports Don't matter there.
Speaker 1:At their essence they're an exercise in warfare and we've taken out so many the guts of it. We want to get into my whole theory of it now, but it just, it just seems like just pointless it.
Speaker 2:Have you been reading blood Meridian?
Speaker 1:No.
Speaker 2:All sports are a practice for war really yeah, I was like one of the devil's arguments for evil and war. Hmm, and aren't all sports just simply practice for war?
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, that's I've, I've, I've not heard of it. I've been saying this for a long time that all sports are just an exercise in warfare, and so maybe there we go, start calling you the judge the micking patch show we were gonna be. We've been talking lots of, so we're talking about, we're starting to be bringing you the the book club here, so maybe we'll have to revisit that the judges in a compliment, though.
Speaker 2:I know, I know.
Speaker 1:The judges. A sounds like a rather rotten guy did off to go discover. But we've got a Well, we'll start. I think we should. I want to start doing it.
Speaker 2:The Well how about instead some books right now, this tonight, rather than watching a movie or playing poker on your phone? Listen to the whole thing straight to the audible on and just fall asleep to audible in your headphones, of that, of that horrible. Yeah, because I imagine when you're watching these movies, when you're going to bed, you have headphones on right To make sure you're not keeping up. My wife, what's the name of your wife? Mace? When did Mace? When do that's right, and so I just put a book on instead and let it lure you away.
Speaker 1:I have been. I have been a reading a book at night and then, but every once while my dirty habit sneaks back in there.
Speaker 2:Hey man, you won't use that dirty habit if you just put a book on and then put your phone down.
Speaker 1:I know, I know I also all listen to. Sometimes I listen to scripture to go to bed.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I do sleep great when I have the Bible playing.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I don't know what it is. I have an old English man's voice. It just some people think it's boring. I do. The celebrity acted Bible.
Speaker 2:Oh really, yeah, Jim Caviesel is the voice of Jesus.
Speaker 1:Oh, wow.
Speaker 2:King James version and it has like 30 something actors who lended their voice to it. Nice.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you look into like real actors too.
Speaker 2:Yeah, like I'm trying remember, I think I have to pull it up. But I have on my app and I paid on my phone and I have it downloaded. I just paid like the 60 bucks one time for it and I just have it always downloaded.
Speaker 1:It's like Seth Rogen, and I want to hear post Malone reading me the Bible some dude, I would actually. Listen to post. You read the Bible.
Speaker 2:Yeah, dude, I just be happy to read the Bible.
Speaker 1:All right, we know that posties one of our listeners. Get started on that.
Speaker 2:Cool, cool, cool. Well, hey, can we love you? We hope you enjoy listening to the show. We hope that you know. Honestly, I hope that most, like most of you, don't agree with us on everything, because we love, like, an diversity of opinion and Learning and growing, and so, whether it's things you agree with or disagree with that we talked about, let us know. But remember, just you know, be kind of one another, be kind of people you're going out in the world with and and yeah, pat, you got any other sign off? Any other updates?
Speaker 1:Thank you, Sam.
Speaker 2:All right till next time.